Who was the mastermind of the decision yesterday to halt the 56th MCA Annual General Meeting to be held in less than 72 hours on Sunday, 7th March 2010?
Not MCA President Datuk Seri Ong Tee Keat though he subsequently claimed that he was the first to call for fresh party polls.
His first comment that his supporters had “expected this long-anticipated development” is the most eloquent admission that he was completely taken by surprise by Chua’s announcement – which was why the Bernama report of Chua’s shock announcement was preceded less than two hours earlier by Ong’s special interview as MCA President on the occasion of Sunday’s 56th MCA AGM, which is as good as spiked!
Not the second MCA Three-Kingdom challenger, MCA Vice Chairman Liow Tiong Lai – though the Liow faction must be very relieved that finally MCA party leadership elections are being held.
If not Ong and Liow, was Chua the mastermind of the move?
Nobody believes that Chua would dare, or to use the Chinese description “have the leopard’s bile”, to abort the 56th MCA AGM to be officially opened by the Prime Minister, Datuk Seri Najib Razak in less than 72 hours without any “green light” from above.
Malaysians are seeing history-in-the-making though not the most elevating one – as for the first time in the 56-year MCA history, fresh party leadership elections had been decided by external remote control!
But what does the new MCA leadership elections really mean to the Malaysian people, in particular the six million Malaysian Chinese?
There is minimal interest or concern among the Malaysian public, whether Chinese or other communities, for the MCA (or for that matter, the other Barisan Nasional component parties including Gerakan and MIC) has never been more irrelevant and inconsequential in Malaysian political history in the corridors of power to the extent that MCA leadership elections could be triggered by the pressing of an external remote-control button!
There is an article in the Chinese press today by a former Chinese journalist entitled “Talents and Serfs”, which captures powerfully the failures of MCA and other BN component parties in Malaysian politics – driving away Malaysian talents overseas to create a two-million strong Malaysian diaspora while leaving behind those in government positions whose first qualifications are to be servile and subservient to the powers-that-be.
UMNO could not afford to let the wounds in MCA fester. So they turned to the tainted MCA leader to lead the open rebellion against Ong Ta Kut. This tainted MCA leader doesn’t have a choice – he has to do UMNO’s bidding or UMNO will get the AG to throw the book at him.
That’s what I mean when we had some serious discussions on this blog as to whether or not this tainted leader should be allowed to return to politics, and there was a particular lawyer – a long-winded commentator here – who argued forcefully against my views. In the same vein, this lawyer argued in favour of a tainted lawyer being given the highest judiciary post in the land.
This is Bolehland – you need insurance policies at every corner, and UMNO only buys insurance policies that work for it, not for the rakyat.
///First time in 56-year MCA history – fresh party leadership elections decided by external remote control/// (Kit)
Oh my gosh!!
And this isn’t the first time in MCA’s history that it has to bow to the wishes of UMNO. Ask Ling Liong Sik and Ong Ka Ting.
MCA is today composed of prostitutes and gigolos. Perhaps Nasir Safar was referring to the MCA.
But today they sell even their souls to UMNO.
Will the Chinese , aligned with the MCA, admit that they have no more dignity left. And that they are willing to forgo dignity in return for material perks (and crumbs) dished out by UMNO.
So, this MCA is going to be led by a porn star from Batu Pahat. Oh, what greatness MCA. You have brought the Chinese to heights of fortune and recognition.
Sure wish I have a similar remote controller. Will use it to send them jokers to infinity and beyond.
MCA to be led by porn star. Oh just think of that possibility. No wonder we were being treated as children of prostitutes by umnoputras.
“First time in 56-year MCA history – fresh party leadership elections decided by external remote control”
Absolutely, that is the Best shot, LKS! I love to hear that…. Keep up….
Can anyone imagine, if Bodohland goes without any opposition parties, esp. DAP has been scrutinizing over decades? It might rot like sh*ts…. Opposition parties, DAP, PAS, PKR & etc, keep up. Doing your pricking and pinching to the corrupted, incompetent and racist BN/UMNO in the Bolenland….
Very well put Dap man! No wonder Nasir Safar, the right hand man of the 1Malaysia PM could brand the Chinese as prostitutes and the Indians as beggers.
The MCA lost all its intergrity and morality with Ling Leong Sik and Ng Ka Ting. The guys who took over are just emasculated and neutered dogs. What UMNO likes and promotes is corruption and porno actors whether the normal kind like Chua or the sodomy star like Sai full.
When MCA the once dominant coalition partner in the BN has been reduced to be puppets with their strings being pulled by UMNO, what can we say about the leadership qualities of the present crop of MCA leaders.
It is really disgusting to note that not only MCA but also GERAKAN is being remote controlled. This happens when the rakyat’s welfare is bartered for personal wealth and worthless titles. Almost all the veteran Opposition leaders are doing a fantastic service to their constituents all these years even though they are not Datuks, Tan Sris or whatever. These Opposition leaders do not even have the means to boast of luxurious mansions like the one built by Zakaria Derus or the Indon pirate, Botox Toyo.
Next move by UMNO would be to nominate their pet poodles in MCA to stand for elections where the UMNO machinery would be put to good use to make their pets run the future of the Chinese in Malaysia.
High time the Chinese see the type of leaders they have and throw them where they belong – the garbage bin. When the MCA AGM is held, make sure to vote only for those who are tainted by money politics and who have a track record of fighting for your rights. Unfortunately the MCA is devoid of such scrupulously clean and honourable leaders anymore.
The Chinese as a whole whether MCA, GERAKAN or DAP should only vote for the OPPOSITION to get rid of the racist and bigotted UMNO in the 13th GE and pave way for a new government in Putra Jaya..
Sorry for the errata in the 2nd last paragraph: …make sure to vote for those who are NOT tainted by …..
well, mca could still be relevant, as an opposition party after the next ge. there are a lot for them to lean from yb lks.
YB
It’s obvious PM Najib is pulling the strings with Soi Lek.
With Najib’s championing direct membership to BN, it’s really the announcement of the death of MCA, MIC, PPP and Gerakan. Bye bye Ong, Samy, Koh and Kayveas. Who loves ya, baby?
There is also a clear intention to consign the PKFZ to the dust bin for a massive cover up. Possibly 2 Indian clerks and 1 Punjabi jaga will eventually be convicted for pilfering PKFZ paper clips and that will be the end of that.
You and Pakatan must not allow the PKFZ scandal and fraud to be trivialised and covered up!! Stay on top of these real GE 2013 issues!
dpp
We are all of 1 race, the Human Race
So what is the relevance of us continuing discussing what is happening in MCA? Does it matter who is likely to win and who is going to lose. Will it make a difference to PKFZ whether it is OTK, CSL, LTL? It is completely irrelevant, am i right?
I received an email from a friend on a piece written by William Leong, the PKR’s Treasurer. I think we should have more pieces like that.
Why talk about MCA?
Yeah. Dat’s right.
Lets talk about something else.
Why is EPF bidding for MRCB?
What for?
This thing about “green light” from outside & above.
If green light endorses ‘fresh party polls’ ;
if fresh party polls and their anticipated results are expected to favour Chua Soi Lek and Liow Tiong Lai more than Ong Tee Keat;
if between Chua & Liow, it means Chua has the lead to be No. 1 in MCA;
if its further assumed that the No. 1 of MCA were ordinarily entitled as part of patronage system, to a cabinet post (though this is not necessarily always the case as its PM/UMNO President’s preogative to decide on cabinet minister;
what is the implication of 1 Malaysia Cabinet of an Islamic country accepting the MCA No. 1 as a minister in light of his earlier scandal???
Wouldn’t the “above” be embarrassed if the MCA No. 1 lobbies for a cabinet position after winning polls?
To say “no” is to go against tradition and facade of power sharing; to say “yes” is embarrassing, not to mention alot of NGOs including perkasa may protest.
So why does the above give the green light that may likely create a train of events leading to it being in a dilemma?
///This is Bolehland – you need insurance policies at every corner, and UMNO only buys insurance policies that work…///
If it were suggested/implied here that by reason of Chua having been tainted by scandal, he becomes an ideal candidate to be supported, to reap the benefit from the results of the poll and to lead MCA so that MCA may be “controlled” by UMNO – how does it reconcile with UMNO’s image of championing religion to have within fold of BN led by it, a leading party like MCA helmed by such a person with scandal?
They even whip women for illicit sex nowadays. How to reconcile that?
One does not need a person “tainted by scandal” for control.
Other previous MCA presidents not tainted by public sexual scandal – were they not equally controlled?
If so, why choose one (with scandal) amongst the other two, for this ‘insurance policy’ that will have drawback of potentially embarrassing oneself, given one’s claim to religiosity?
Therefore the argument the more tainted the better the insurance in post #1 does not sound plausible.
You can control someone – if he has a scandal not one knows, and you threaten to divulge or leak it if he does not toe the line!
You can’t control someone on a scandal that is already public knowledge and in spite of that got majority support in MCA!
The argument – that scandal enhances control and improve insurance to control – put forth just does not hold water when scandal is already known nationally & internationally!
The Russians wanted to blackmail Sukarno by having “a Russian swallow” to seduce Sukarno and the Russians told him that if he did not do their bidding they would expose him.
Sukarno was already well known amongst his countrymen for his voracious appetite for women.
He told the Russians – please make it public, at least my countrymen will now know that I even scored with your Russian women as well (added to the long list)!!
Who would be crazy enough to buy insurance on a man on a scandal that is already public and hence cannot be leveraged against him weighed against the fact that supporting him gets a boomerang effect of having one’s own religious credentials (that one is building up on the “Allah” issue/whipping issue) questioned/contradicted for supporting a tainted horse, so to speak?
The cost and benefit just don’t add up for the suggestion to make sense!
MCA is finished one way or the other. The only guy who seems to have a modicum of sense left is Ong Tee Keat.
The others will all be forgotten in the dustbins of MCA history. Win or lose, Ong Tee Keat must be courageous enuf to do some derring-do groundbreaking feat by pulling MCA out of BN and aligning with PR as independents.
How can anyone with any sense left in them even think of a marriage with BN, huh? Najib and Muhyiddin as bedfellow? huh? U wud be screwed left right, center, top, bottom and in an infinity of rotations to boot.
Isn’t It Funny…despite all the internal problems faced by DAP …LKS still have leisure time to talk about ‘Other people matter’….Maybe it would be better….. if he could coach his son to be efficient at work….Someone can see a louse as far away as China but is not aware of an elephant on his nose…..
“Cost and benefit” has a very different meaning for UMNO and for the rest of us mortals. They can commence investigations on any aspect of the CSL scandal at any time – which includes sodomy or leakage of another video or even merely suggesting that such a possibility exists. If that happens, what is CSL going to do ?
You highlight about the incongruence of UMNO’s stand on religion vs its suport of the porn star. In 30 years, UMNO has always twisted the facts to suit its purpose. How do you explain the fact that corrupt people still hold senior positions in the party ?
Cakap tak serupa bikin is the motto of UMNO – and that includes their stand on religion, corruption, transparency, fairness. The latest thread in this blog attests to the UMNO appointed AG’s hypocrisy. It is all in their blood.
“Other previous MCA presidents not tainted by public sexual scandal – were they not equally controlled?”
Did anyone suggest that the taint needs to be sexual to be controlled by UMNO ?
MCA is asked to sort out its internal mess by this “outsider” through holding fresh elections to ascertain a new, rightful and lawful leadership.
Will this powerful “outsider” do the same and direct that Perak sort itself out through the same means i.e. by holding fresh elections for a new lawful and legal government?
But no! We are Double standards country.
The remaining members of MCA central committee decided that the AGM scheduled for 7 March would carry on as planned. Indeed, they did not have the mandate to change the date of the AGM which had been decided by the central committee previously. Since the meeting of MCA Youth and Wanita is linked to the AGM curiously the Chiefs of these two wings usurped power in declaring postponement of their respective AGM. They must have thought that MCA exists only for the elected officials numbering a few dozens. If that was so why do they claim to have million strong membership?
The problems in MCA might not be resolved with a new election which was brought about by infighting of elected officials. They have succeeded in treating MCA as an conduit for making personal gains, and differences among elected officials centre only around position and influence rather than approaches on how to ensure that MCA carry out the duties of why the association was formed in the first place.
Officials elected from the fresh election should have the right to serve out a three-year term, based on MCA constitution. But because of the refusal of the chiefs of Youth and Wanita to face election at the same time, elected central committee members will have their term terminated at the same time as that of the Youth and Wanita. If the new central committee members choose to stay for three years then the two branches’ chiefs will stay on for four and half. Otherwise, the new 32 central committee members can serve only for one and a half year. This is an example of how a minority of two persons decide the fate of 32 new Central Committee members. It is just an extension of how the same two persons decide that the central delegates of the Youth ad Wanita wings of MCA do not have a chance to meet on the schedule date. That reflects democracy at work in MCA.
Riduan Tee Abdollah may be appointed a senator and then installed as the new mca president
To all the intelligent asses out there. MCA is controlled even none of its leaders has any scandal. MCA has existed for a wrong reason. IF we all know UMNO is about race supremacy and keeping all the goodies to itself, why do you think UMNO would want MCA, MIC and Gerakan? It is a misnomer if we say UMNO needs true partners. No, UMNO needs no partners. UMNO only need stupid, greedy and corrupted leaders from among the non Malays to give them the multiracial and cosmopolitan image to the world. Intelligent ass, got it?
///Did anyone suggest that the taint needs to be sexual to be controlled by UMNO ?///- Godfather
It need not be a taint to be controlled : greed for positions, crumbs in gravy train suffice.
Which is why Lim Kam Put makes the rebuttal – “MCA is controlled even none of its leaders has any scandal.”
//Intelligent ass, got it?//
We all knew that since we were 2 years old.
The best way to stop Viagra Chua from usurping the mca (as intended by Jibby) is to get his ex-mistress Angela Yam to reveal everything about that old buffalo’s misdeeds, warts and all.
///To all the intelligent asses out there. MCA is controlled even none of its leaders has any scandal……….Intelligent ass, got it?/// (post #25) – Lim Kam Put
Now, Lim Kam Put, don’t insult Godfather (for arguing that it needs taint of sexual nature as well as other forms of taint) to be controlled by UMNO)! At least he reasons acceptably.
Its all over town among Chinese community leaders that even Rosmah had input on what is going on. The Chinese community are sheething, calling MCA leaders pai-kah chai (prodigal children) which in Confucionist chinese, which many Malaysian still are, is the lowest form of life – worst than prostitutes, eunuchs, traitors.
Najib does all these scheming but it comes out nevertheless. Its seriously pathetic that he and his wife still deluded in thinking of him as even competent much less deserving of the job that he has. People who get lucky but don’t know it deserve to have their teeth kicked in. If they continue to insist on their delusion after being kicked, when they fall, they deserved to be stepped on and runned over.. Both of them are like Marcos-Imelda at the end of their tenure. The difference is we are not going to let them leave when it all comes down. We are going to sent both of them into the lockup and take everything away…
NO, Jeffrey, i am not insulting Godfather, i am insulting you. You got it all wrong.
Give a pistol to each and every white-eyed pea of the mca and let them finish each other off. The country would be a much happier place without these buggers.
Hope Ong, Chua and Liow are reading this advice
MCA from a beggar political party turned Porn theater…with strong Mongolian interests!
MCA is only in name, it really is “Melayu Captured Association!”
///NO, Jeffrey, i am not insulting Godfather, i am insulting you. You got it all wrong.///
However it was never my position that the MCA’s man with a scandal (esp when publicly known) could by that fact of the scandal already known be controlled by UMNO. This is where I disagreed with Godfather’s interpretation – that it would.
I also said “it need not be a taint to be controlled : greed for positions, crumbs in gravy train suffice” – which is in line/parallel with what you said about “To all the intelligent asses out there. MCA is controlled EVEN NONE of its leaders has any scandal…UMNO only need stupid, greedy and corrupted leaders from among the non Malays to give them the multiracial and cosmopolitan image to the world……….Intelligent ass, got it?”.
So who is the ass whose understanding of the issue is to insult me on a position put forward by another (ie Godfather), and then turn around to say you are insulting me (when my position is parallel with yours)based on a lack of understanding of what as being exchanged/discussed/argued earlier between Godfather and me ?
You are too quick to use the word “ass” on others even before you understood the exchange. Thats the problem of puting your own head far up your ass for too long that you keep uttering that word!
OK, Ong Tee Keat, u just have to be man enuf to do the right thing. Principles first, right?
Whether u win or lose, principles first, ok. Get the heck out of BN before u drag all d Chinese to hell with BN, ok?
If Chua wins, then all hell breaks lose when MCA is turned into a harem of prostitutes. If Liow wins, then MCA will be a bunch of kittens in this year of the tiger. So u must win, ok? Then, do what u must do as a matter of principle, ok. How can u share the same bed with such bedfellows as najib and Muhyiddin, c’mon man? Ok, u don’t need anyone of us to teach u basic maths functions but u know function of a function is all about composite functions – u can never be independent. Simple maths. U can’t bed with immoral, lawless, unscrupulous hunks and rambos. Period.
Who cares what is going to happen to MCA except some greedy leader s of theirs. MCA will soon out of business! when MCA can’t contribute Chinese votes to Umno’s BN. Umno has to think a way to manage the Chinese voters themselves rather than depending on unreliable MCA. If Umno can outsource his life line of Malay Supremacy to Perkasa, what make MCA think they are not replaceable?
The MCA blames the lost of support of Chinese due to Umno’s policies, and MCA is powerless by Umno in BN. But, Umno blames it to the internal power strangle culture of MCA and powerless by their greed of power and needed to be replaced or tightly controlled. Either MCA to be replaced or tightly controlled puppet, the destiny is doom. In the law of nature: Born, grow, rotten and finally died, so it is at stage 3.5 into 4 now.
///Mar 5, 10 10:47PM
BREAKING NEWS Prime Minister Najib Razak will not be attending the disputed MCA annual general meeting this Sunday.///– Malaysiakini
Najib has the right not to attend, and with that decision he tells MCA central delegates who are the lapdogs he would prefer. The election to be held on 28 March is a chance for the central delegates to tell Najib whether they want Najib to have his lapdogs to represent MCA, or those who will serve MCA interest. MCA central delegates now have a clear signal to make their choice. With that the Chinese will also know how to vote in the coming GE.
I think MCA members should leave the party and join DAP. I mean it’s no point staying in a party which is liken to a fly without a head flying around aimlessly.
MCA has no balls to leave BN, unless Gerakan and MIC take the lead to do so.
Stay of not, most of the MCA candidates will lose their deposits during the next GE.
I think MCA members should leave the party and join DAP. – frankyapp
Indecent proposal.
The AGM scheduled for 7 March remains valid whether or not some members of the Central Committee resigned their posts. As members of the party, the ex-CM members are free to participate in the AGM or not. Indeed, the remaining members of the Central Committee are duty bound to carry out the AGM as scheduled. But Najib’s action shows that he wants the rebels in MCA be indebted to him. One wonders too whether his action has any thing to do with PKFZ affairs.
Though Najib has the right to stay away from the AGM, he has negated on his obligation after having agreed to attend. Surely the status of the AGM is not in dispute. In staying way, Najib only creates the impression that the Youth and Wanita branches of MCA have his support. Najib is taking side in the internal power struggle within MCA.
The heads of other BN component parties have surely been invited to the opening of MCA AGM. The absence of other party leaders will tell us they they have their balls deposited with Najib.
Majority Malaysian Chinese could not care less about MCA.
Voted out in 12th GE..and that will alawys be in the voters minds…to teach Najib….not to fool with voters anymore.
MCA is a disgrace to the Chinese community….since Ling Liong Sik took over.
As usual…asking Malaysians to forget the past and look forward is a joke.
MCA will be buried in 13th GE….by voters..and will teach Najib…who are the bosses in the country.
Najib want to play race and religion politics…divide and rule..and MCA is just a puppet to Najib.
How low can you go….declaring so call….representing the Chinese race.
MIC is finished by the Indians.
Mark my word…Malaysians Chinese will finish MCA again…to shame Najib…keep disrespecting Malaysians…as if UMNO BARU own the country and people…to do as they like.
We have experienced all sorts of “stunts”….low class promotional campaign.
We will tolerate with disobedience…with no violence..giving Najib..no reasons..to find ways and means..not to have 13th GE…as scheduled.
He can smile and act as much as he like…but deep inside…vast majority Malaysians know..how worried Najib is…which includes MCA and Gerakan.
Najib have so many unanswered accusations hanging in his head….and he can talk till all the cows come back…People’s Power is waiting to show…who really holds the power for the country.
It is well and good for MCA members to abandon ship and join DAP en bloc or in large numbers. But DAP has to be careful becos some Chinese are willing to lend themelves to be Trojan horses and to come in and destroy DAP from the inside just like what UMNO is doing by infiltrating PKR and starting the bonfire. DAP will have to vet them before selecting those bona fide for key positons.
Anyway, expect MCA to implode. All the bridges have been detonated. The last bridge will go under when the ‘prostitutes’ or the ‘kittens’ have crossed.
Cintanegara…DAP is calm and riding high…very popular with Malaysians….and LKS is famous to expose all sorts of things…to get DAP there.
LKS is so successful…and it takes an idiot like you…to teach him how to manage his life?
It is your mind that play tricks with you…reading too much one sided news from papers.
Please stop making a fool of yourself.
But then…you need to talk like that…to carry Najib balls…correct?
Najib is not attending Sunday’s AGM – probably more for his own sake of not being embarrassed. It’s a disputed EGM. MCA Central committee of course wants it to proceed and has directed Youth and Wanita to attend. Legally the AGM could of course still convene (requiring a quorum of only 200 delegates) : however what’s the point if this Central Committee pushing for AGM is only 1/3 in original strength after Chua & his cohorts withdraw their support for Ong and resigned from Central Committee; or if more than half the MCA delegates decide not to show up for the AGM following the resignations of their leaders? Will this not only embarrass Ong but also the PM as guest to attend more than ½ empty AGM?
Of course one could read into it that the PM’s cancellation of attendance is a sign of supporting Chua/Liow camp in favour of fresh polls and boycotting AGM favoured by Ong. (However if he attends under such disputed circumstances he would also be seen supporting Ong against the other two in majority – either way he is seen taking sides and interfering in MCA politics)! I rather think its just to save himself from personal embarrassment from having to go through a charade of an AGM pushed for by a president who lost support of majority of delegates. If one does not get his own house tidied up, how to invite VIP guest over????
Somehow Ong’s initial outspokenness on PKFZ issue makes some of us romanticize the notion that he’s a better MCA leader to stand up against Big brother UMNO, and that UMNO would prefer others like “Viagra” Chua, compromised by scandal.
I doubt that UMNO leadership has any particular preference for any faction, especially Chua whose scandal embarrasses UMNO – because whosoever (scandal or no scandal) leads, the MCA leaders know who butters their bread; their positions are beholden to UMNO; MCA is controlled by “external remote control” for decades, and recent turmoil and power struggle is unlikely to change this unequal power relations.
MCA is finished, one way or other. Implosion, explosion, they are already doomed. MCA has no more respect. This is really shameful.
The Chinese must abandon MCA and vote only for Pakatan Rakyat.
This asshole association do not represent the people they claimed to represent…ROC please instruct them to change the name or just close it up.
It has insulted the very people they claimed to represent….chinese people already got so much trouble directed at them , including these fellas who added salt to their wounds…
luckily CHINA gave them some pride back.
Majority Malaysian Chinese could not care less about MCA. – monsterball
That is where the problem lies, we couldn’t care less. We had a minority of crooked business politicians sitting on billions of ringgit of assets accumulated over 50 years do nothing but plunder, all this in the name of representing the Chinese. If you are a Malaysian Chinese, you are entitled to that assets because it is partly yours, every one of us has the right to claim it from MCA, and the sooner we do this, the better for all of us. Remember, politics is not just about vote!
You can’t control someone on a scandal that is already public knowledge and in spite of that got majority support in MCA!
The argument – that scandal enhances control and improve insurance to control – put forth just does not hold water when scandal is already known nationally & internationally! – Jeffrey
What is left out is that oral sex is involved and that is punisable by, I think, jail and caning!
So far, nothing in this direction has been carried out – yet!
So, Jeffrey, ponder on that!
What the ….no need to physically attend…read the meaning not the sentence.
These e- societies you cant be too carefool , have hand phone will travel
Many of their sympathisers are still in wishful thinking state. Except for those who has BIG STAKES trapped in their FIASCO will never leave ….some of them CANNOT LEAVE at all ….blackmailed.
Only the good ones can leave….we will see.
It is well and good for MCA members to abandon ship and join DAP en bloc or in large numbers. – ENDANGERED HORNBILL
No can do! The best option for MCA if its members want to retain the “Chinese” word is to opt out from politics and become a full fledged welfare organization or a racist NGO.
It was reported that Prime Minister Najib Razak will not be attending the disputed MCA annual general meeting this Sunday. Najib’s absence is going to be read as a lost of support for incumbent MCA President Ong Tee Keat.
If the head of BN does not want to recognize MCA, I don’t see how MCA under Ong Tee keat can garner support from the Chinese. This is how UMNO can force a change in MCA leadership – simply stay away from important MCA meetings to show its disapproval of MCA leadership.
Najib will not attend and open this Sunday’s MCA AGM. Why?
Because it is not 1MCA. It is 1/3MCA.
All BN leaders are tainted. Its a badge of honour. It is a prerequisite. Otherwise what do they all talk about when they meet up?
You don’t compromise the ordinary people BASIC rights and entitlements under the Constitution for personal and short term gains.
Like other smaller component parties in BN, they played its narrow, short term and damaging politics of race and religion…..they lost all credibility and integrity to represent their respective community.
If these so-called ” leaders/politicians ” have any pride and dignity left, they should apologise to the ordinary people and resign immediately.
In the best interest of the country, in particular the Chinese community, DAP should have nothing to do with MCA or Gerakan….it is in the best interest of DAP to totally stay away from them.
Cintanegara
You amused me with your retarded brain giving comments expected from an UMNO sh#t stirrer.
HAVE A NICE DAY, LITTLE WORM!
Winston, your comments #49, although oral sex is punishable offence (unnatural sex), and an offence has no limitation period, and is a function of prosecutorial discretion, they -powers that be – can’t explain why action was not taken when he admitted to it 2 years ago in Jan 2008 unless one deems it that prosecutorial discretion was exercised (then) in his favour having regard to fact that he was more the victim of a consensual situation with a personal willing partner whose privacy was invaded; also there was sufficient punishment from shame when he voluntarily owned up and resigned from various positions. In the history of prosecutions here, they don’t prosecute on oral sex per se unless its accompanies with some other reprehensible criminal behaviour like violence, rape robbery and so on.
The threat of the possibility of them (authorities) prosecuting later is slim, and mitigated by the onus being thrown on them to explain why they did not take action 2 years ago in Jan 2008 and creates the adverse presumption that they are keeping it for balckmail.
This kind of thing, once publicly known, and no investigation even needed to account for any delay due to the actor’s own admission, the authorities have to make decision to prosecute or not and once it is not done, it is as good as treating matter is closed because they just simply cannot explain why they decide to prosecute much much later!
Hi guys,is there any front page top head line from the STAR and UTUSAN on the M.V.MCA sinking ?. Why is it the Captain of the mother ship M.V.BN not coming to rescue its sinking son ? Now the rest of the smaller ships such as the M.V.’s MIC,GERAKAN,PBS,UPKO,SUPP PRS etc especially its respective captains should be aware that its MASTER CAPTAIN NR is not to be trusted in time of danger/trouble or even death. I think these captains should abandon their captain NR before he abandons you guys.
Jeffrey, your post #8 is an example of naivety. You will continue to amaze me with your confusion over legality and political manoeuvring.
Lim Kam Put, re your post #10, your amazement does not surprise me the least. The last I recall you confused between who said what and tried insulting me based on another’s position!
Perpetually plagued with ‘foot-in-mouth’ and ‘head in ass’ syndrome, what you lack in understanding is more than made up for by you in abundant amazement on innumerable occasions on simple matters.
cintanegara on Friday, 5 March 2010 – 6:49 pm: “Isn’t It Funny…despite all the internal problems faced by DAP …LKS still have leisure time to talk about ‘Other people matter’….Maybe it would be better….. if he could coach his son to be efficient at work….Someone can see a louse as far away as China but is not aware of an elephant on his nose…”
Q: Which political party suddenly had its AGM stopped days before it was scheduled to take place?
A: MCA, not DAP.
Q: Which political party now suddenly has to have fresh party leadership polls?
A: MCA, not DAP.
Q: So, which political party obviously has a leadership power struggle going on?
A: Of course, MCA, and not DAP.
Thus, if the DAP leadership is unaware of an elephant on its nose, that is because the elephant is actually on the MCA leadership’s nose.
Now, isn’t that funny?
Jeffrey:
Limkamput is correct in calling you “naive”, especially after your posting of #8 above. Prosecutorial discretion simply means that the AG’s Chambers can decide whether to prosecute and when to prosecute without having to explain the rational of such decision. To say that after 2 years of non-prosecution is as good as “case closed” is complete naivete because it depends on who you know, and whether or not such closure is in the interests of the powers to be. It is never in the interest of the country.
The final “test” of your naivete is when you say that the onus is on the prosecution to explain why they did not take action 2 years earlier. Explain to whom ? If you don’t know that they don’t really care to explain their actions (or inaction) then you have been living on a different planet from us.
Q: So, which political party obviously has a leadership power struggle going on?
A: Of course, MCA, and not DAP.
You have missed out the PPP, MIC, Mahkal Sakti, Gerakan and even umno
Liow and Chua factions dispute the legality of the MCA AGM scheduled for 7 March, but the AGM is not in dispute.
There is nothing in the MCA constitution that demands more than one-third of Central Committee members to attend the AGM. Thus the resignation of two-third of the CM members does not in any way affect the legality of the AGM which had been scheduled and planned. Liow claimed that resolutions to be tabled at the AGM require the approval of the central committee which is no longer in existence. That is true, but what had been approved previously by the legally constituted Central Committee remains valid. Thus, the AGM should run as if nothing had happened to the Central Committee. Indeed, the remaining membership of the CM has the responsibility to finish off the job planned by the CM which includes convening the AGM. It seems that that was too much for Najib to comprehend.
Chua chose to cause the resignation of two-third of the CM just days before the AGM for the sake of causing dispute, and making Najib to show who he preferred. So, it is not because Najib might face vacant seats among the delegates which made him scarce, Najib should be seen as the mastermind to the timing of Chua’s resignation from the CM, and causing OTK to face the dilemma of what to do with the planned AGM which had once been postponed, and has to be held unless approval for further postponement is agreed upon by the ROS. Chua and Liow chose to embarrass OTK, and Najib was the brain behind the scheme.
The fact that Chinese are disappointed with MCA is beyond doubt. The Chinese face the dilemma of not supporting MCA. They want MCA to be in the government so as to claim the agreement reached among the three major parties which negotiated for Malaya’s independence.They are unhappy with the performance of MCA leaders who made use of their position to enrich themselves rather than to do a limkitsiang for the country, fighting for the legitimate rights of Malaysians. The Chinese would be happy if MCA would stay as a independent party, outside BN. But the three-factions in MCA show that two of them are willing to sell the souls, for their own benefits.
The Najib no-show at the AGM should tell the MCA delegates that Najib prefers the turn-coats who he could control to somebody who are willing to stand up for the rights of Malaysians. It is obvious that PKFZ features prominently in the current strife within MCA. OTK may not be the hero, but he, as the Transport Minister, did not keep PKFZ under the carpet.
The current dispute in MCA started with Liow faction wanted to kill off Chua and OTK took the stand to effect that change. Now Liow and Chua join hands trying to finish off OTK. If they succeed, then MCA central delegates who vote in the 28 March election would be devoid of Chinese culture. MCA would then have the same fate as OTK.
Let’s see who have their balls kept by Najib at the AGM tomorrow.
We know in this country everything about who one knows and the lack of any need for Prosecutor to account how he exercises discretion, whether to drop or continue and the type/quality of reasons given for eg two reporters of the Al-Islam magazine.
Yet there is a line that has not been crossed: some alleged offence committed, sensationalised in public, everyone knows its an offence, there is no need to even investigate the offence because the wrong doer (a prominent person) has admitted to it, no action was taken by way of exercise of prosecutorial discretion for as long as two years (which reasonably) raises the assumption of finality on part of wrong doer of how that discretion has been exercised – in his favour – and then mysteriously, after that the discretion was (assumed) exercised, to re-activate the nmatter and charge that person (for what ever reasons, political personal or whatever).
There is such a thing as finality, in such matters of prosecutorial discretion of not keeping an ax over a man’s head for ever./
It is different if the case is pending investigation. Not enough evidence even after 2 yaers, evidence found on the 4th year so you charge.
But where’s there’s no need for investigation or pending investigation – where the evidence is for all to see on video on the Net and where the actor comes out to say, thats me, and you can charge him immediately – and you don’t? Not just two years – lets extend the argument to (say) 8 years, and all of a sudden out of the blue you decide to charge him? You think you can do that without explaining why the long lapse and then the sudden reactivation ? Won’t it be malicious prosecution?
One can say Boleh land is different, don’t follow rules, Ok if so orove me wrong and cite one or two of such cases, in the Malaysian Context, where in parallel situtation, this has happened – please enlighten me which one or two cases (where there’s no need to investigate, a high profile case that everyone knows an offence is committed, no problem on evidence, yet the prosecution has delayed for no apparent reason for 2 years and equally for no apparent reasons re-activated prosecution?
The preceding posting is directed at you Godfather.
Every prosecutor has inherent discretion to prosecute or not: don’t get me wrong that I am saying that execise of discretion may notr be influenced by extraneous political considerations . It may well be the case. Friends of powerful people not prosecuted. (Political opponents instead are).
However once that discretion is exercised when not pursuing a case like Chua’s (where one looks at the particulars of that offence – ie consensual sex involving oral (carnal) which is techincally an offence but as a matter of discretion not exercised at all against rest of populace doing the same thing except they’re not having their privacy violated like Chua), can you keep it in your file for another decade and then spring him a charge?
Perhaps you not grasping there’s such an idea of finality in prosecutorial discretion, known or reasonably expected after 2 years lapse (in circumstances where offence is clear, whole public know about, it’s even admitted to and there’s no need for further investigation to justify delay in not prosecuting).
Goodness me Jeffrey, what you have just written is a typical example of someone dropping into a sh!t hole and is now trying to crawl out of it.
Simply put, CSL is not charged not because of finality or non finality; evidence or no evidence; how much time has elapsed since the “offence”; whether there is credible explanation or otherwise; and whether or not willing parties were involved. There is no need to charge him for now because there is no political reason for it. When there is a NEED to charge him, he WILL be charged no matter what, got it sage?
Lim Kam Put : your comments show again you have not understood what I said. Think abit before you comment. I have no reason to take it upon myself to explain further.
Why argue over these MCA chaps?
Are they worth our time to debate on ?
Only UmnoUtusans are relevant. We should focus on them or we may have to ship out like those 2 million diaspora now.
This is the end of the show for MCA, the great movie of machais, crooks and ass-holes.
After the curtain finally comes down, BN/UMNO will celebrate with a new slogan ..”One Down Two To Go”.
“….can you keep it in your file for another decade and then spring him a charge?” Jeffrey
If you think that the answer is a “no”, then you are truly naive. This administration will leave no stone unturned if it deems it appropriate to use any form of leverage against its political opponents or against those that it wishes to keep in line.
Finality in prosecutorial discretion ? Do they teach this in law school ? Is it in the statutes or are there successful appeals against non-finality or is it just a principle that can be ignored or cast aside when it suits those who wish to cling to power ?
So I now have to cite an example of how “delayed” prosecution has occurred in Bolehland ? Is this on the basis that if it had never happened in the past, it certainly is not likely to happen in the future ? Has anyone been charged with sodomy when doctors have testified that there is no evidence of penetration ?
Isn’t Anwar’s case an example of “malicious prosecution” ?
One cannot be naive when living under this adminstration. Even CSL knows this.
Anwar’s case is an example viewed by many as improper exercise of prosecutorial discretion in sense that hardly anyone else (in absence of other aggravated accompanying offences like robbery/rape accopmpanyinmg it) is prosecuted for sodomy (but the opposition head). Still they could argue come forth and argue that in other cases not prosecuted it is because no one came forth to complain about being buggered but here there is Saiful giving evidence….Again here one can counter by saying there’s alleged improper exercise of prosecutorial discretion because one ought not to throw the charge when evidence of essential ingredient of penetration is lacking based on initial 3 medical reports.
Anwar’s case is not however comparable to Chua’s case because here the moment the alleged offence/Saiful’s complain was publicly known, investigations were launched and prosecutorial discretion was known made to charge Anwar, and he was charged….
For Anwar’s case to be used as a point of argument to rebut what I said, it must hypothetically be parallel to Chua Soi Lek’s case in the following:-
· Anwar was caught in video with Saiful doing the illicit Act;
· Or even if not, investigations and medical report show overwhelmingly there’s penetration; or
· Anwar says publicly “yes I did it, it was consensual”,
leading to circumstances showing that there is no need at all to further investigate/prove and establish “who did it “, the public also all know the act is an offence opening the way to immediate preferring of a charge and prosecution– and yet most important:
after all these and Saiful’s report/complaint, nothing is done by authorities, two, three or five years pass and all of the sudden the AG got up on the wrong side of the bed (or for whatever other reason) he throws the charge at Anwar. Can this be done without an explanation? Has it ever been done in the past, crossing this line?
So when I ask where are the one or two cases showing such a line has been crossed, you surely cannot be that naive to think that your citation of Anwar’s case, is a parallel one in circumstances to Chua Soi Lek’s 2 year lapse of prosecution to show how improper execise of prosecutorial discretion of Anwar’s circumstances prove the same may be done in Chua Soi Lek’s case – when circumstances wise its like comparing ornage with an apple.
In fact I was asking why charge Anwar – when they not charging Chua Soi Lek? Why the selective treatment? (I was actually suggesting both ought not to be charged because countless others are not charged). Here they counter in Chua’s case no one lodge a complaint, certainly not Angela Yam that reportedly went to China, so it is with other countless consensual cases…but here Saiful, for whatever motivations, lodge a police compliant – thats the difference. They cannot of course explain why if its consensual he lodged a compliant or why they proceed on a consensual charge when the chief witness & complainant goes to court suggesting he was coerced : these are irreconcilable contradictions.
One has also the look at the nature of crime. Oral sex/sodomy are archaic laws which whilst exist in books are almost never actively enforced unless they are aggravated by reason of other serious offences accompanying the proscribed act eg rape, robbery, committing it on underage persons. So where there are no aggravated circumstances exist, when one exercises prosecutorial charges not to charge – even if all evidence is there to do so immediately including an admission – the public can understand, and conversely cannot understand why after exercising such discretion not to charge for 2, 3, 5 years, some suddenly re-activate the charge.
This does not apply to a crime like say robbery or murder considered heinous by public and known to be actively prosecuted wth laws against enforced cconsistently all the time.
In these cases an exceptional lapse in that consistency – as when prosecution does nothing after 2 years or even 10 years or more and then all of sudden reactivate it – public would not question such flip flop in exercise of prosecutorial discretion because by nature they are heinous, not forgivable – not parallel to consensual oral sex/sodomy which though the laws still say they are a crime, the laws are honoured more in hypocrisy of such cases being overlooked & not being enforced in relation to general populace (except for very selective cases involving aggravated accompanying circumstances earlier mentioned).
Still trying to find his way out of the sh!t hole. Let me add, if there is a line to be crossed, it will be crossed. It does not matter whether or not there is a report made or otherwise. Just ask the opposition how many police reports have they made in the past, and ask them how many were actually investigated, charged and found guilty.
In Malaysia, many people like to make police reports. Mind you, if making a false police report is a crime, why didn’t the police charge those for making reports that were found untrue.
Lim Kam Put,
Thats why I say you butt in without understanding whats being discussed.
The statement “….if there is a line to be crossed, it will be crossed…” assumes the authorities have no line, follows no law, and cares no limitations whatsoever.
On that premise there it is nothing to discuss anything here or anywhere else for Kit or us to blog on rationale, right or wrong and thats the end of the matter. What we are doing here then?
Then the position – that with the Malaysian Govt ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE having no line or limits – if that were the position put forth there is no need for further argument here because right at the outset in my posting #8 I have already qualified “The threat of the possibility of them (authorities) prosecuting later is SLIM, and MITIGATED by the onus being thrown on them to explain why they did not take action 2 years ago in Jan 2008 and creates the adverse presumption that they are keeping it for blackmail.
The words SLIM & MITIGATED imples, if you don’t understand the words, there is no suggestion of impossibility of anything done by Malaysian authorities. They mean the unlikelihood in Chua’s case having regard to all circumstances of his case (already discussed) in contrast/comparison to Anwar’s case for leverage to be made out of Chua’s case.
The simple thing and it takes so long for you to understand and argue all over the place : no wonder a past commentator SpeakUp mentioned it was a waste of time and a tax of patience to address any of your obtuse comments!
if thats the premise…..
Jeffrey, I do not pick on you and my comments were sincerely made. Your possibility of “slim and mitigated” prosecution is based on some fanciful logics which do not make sense to me given the pattern of behaviour of this government. There is only one premise: CSL will not be charged if he does not “cross the line”. If he crosses it, the chance is no longer slim and there will be sufficient explanation for the charge against him (whether or not you like the explanation or otherwise). Don’t be too arrogant, you don’t have the monopoly to wisdom.
///Your possibility of “slim and mitigated” prosecution is based on some fanciful logics which do not make sense to me given the pattern of behaviour of this government./// – LimKamPut.
It is not ‘fanciful logics’ because as a matter of practical experience, that line (of exercising prosecutorial discretion not to prosecute based on the extenuating circumstances of Chua Soi Lek’s case] has never been crossed before by Malaysian govt, judging from the fact that no one can cite a parallel case of like circumstances where Prosecutor re-activated a case after a long lapse and yet escapes being challenged whether in court or in public relam. The case of Anwar cited as been differentiated as not been alike. So what fanciful logics is that when there has been no case before like that? And even then I did not discount all possibility.
Anything is possible in this world especially with regards the Malaysian govt, but having said that, I have also mentioned the likelihood of the govt’s crossing the line on this issue of finality of prosecutor’s discretion of which Chua is entitled to rely after 2 years lapse is “slim” & “mitigated”. The words by their ordinary meaning mean possible but not likely as to constitute a factor of indeterminate leverage (without finality) by Chua on him on the part of govt.
“Crossing the line” here is on the government’s part in a finality on Prosecutor’s exercise of prosecutorial discretion, either to prosecute or forget about it, in this case in reference to the latter. It does not bear reference to what you said – “CSL will not be charged if he does not “cross the line”, in that sense. If if Chua does so (crossing the line in your sense) the govt would have crossed its line if it starts prosecuting after a long lapse of times. Whilst possible its not likely because it has to justify and explain why it does so.
It seems that you always want to butt in – and argue, if possible criticisze or insult – in a discussion where discussants are proceeding already on the fourth floor whilst you still tyrailing at the basement of the building/structure of what is being discussed.
I have made no claim to any “monopoly to wisdom” but by the way your attack others comments from the vantage point of the basement you certainly have the monopoly of obtuseness- and silliness, your thoughts like a concoction of mixed ingredients in a wide but shallow plate of your mind which easily spills over their obnoxious contents the moment the plate is jarred by the slightest movement of the the base on which the plate of your thoughts/prejudices comfortably sits.
Ooops typo/spelling mistakes rectified in capitals:-
” The case of Anwar cited HAS been differentiated ……whilst you still TRAILING at the basement”.
///if there is a line to be crossed, it will be crossed. It does not matter whether or not there is a report made or otherwise///
Police Report is only one out of the many other differences. In Anwar’s case the moment the offence is known, the offence is investigated and charge is preferred. In latter’s case (even with admission of guilt), no mention of any action to which Chua is entitled to rely that prosecutorial discretion has been exercised in his favour.
(In all other cases eg Perwaja and connected people, they are different; there are protracted investigations but no prosecution because they say investgations uncover no solid proof that can stand in court of law, therefore no charge).
This is very different in Chua’s case. the proof is there; he even admits to it; everyone (public) knows about the case and technicality of the offence. Yet two years lapse, and continuing: is there no presumption of finality to hanging a guillotine over someone’s head, that they can, for no rhyme and reason, simply after 20 years re-activate & throw this charge of oral sex against Chua when he is (say) 90 years old by then (because then he writes against the govt like ex Justice NH Chan?) You know the silliness of that scenario?
The govt for all its arbitrariness in doing things – you cite to me 1 or 2 cases like & parallel to Chua’s, that they (authorities) have ever re-activated a charge contrary to presumption of finality.
Whilst possible its not likely because it has to justify and explain why it does so.// Jeffrey
This is where we differ. Whether it is likely or not is NOT based on whether the government is able to justify or explain. Whether it is likely or not, to me, would depend on whether it is expedient or otherwise and given the pattern of behaviour, motivation and orientation of this government, my argument is definitely more cogent than yours.
You are forever talking about basement and fifth floor. Basement is at least better than someone in the sh!t hole. You don’t have to answer if you find my comment obtuse; it is for others to read and judge.
I am challenging to cite one or 2 cases parallel to Chua’s case because we’re talking of the same thing – the “pattern of behaviour of this government”. In spite of this “arbitrary” pattern that we all know has it crossed the line of reactivating a charge on a known crime requiring no further proof after a long lapse of no mention of investigation/prosecution?
If you can cite one such case of parallel circumstances as chua I will concede that my argument of “slim” possibility becomes no more slim but even probable as a leverage.
You should know that the basement is where the shit hole really is, a collective and final depository, collecting all waste, effuses, refuse, faeces, etc from the top.
rreposting : the basement is where its situated – the collective and final depository, from which all waste, effuses, refuse, etc from the top flow down and are deposited.
“into which” – not from which.
The govt for all its arbitrariness in doing things – you cite to me 1 or 2 cases like & parallel to Chua’s, that they (authorities) have ever re-activated a charge contrary to presumption of finality.// Jeffrey
Whether or not there was such a case before would prove us nothing! We are talking about motivation selective prosecution and persecution. Since when does it need precedence, justification or explanation? If the government has not done it before, it is not because they have chosen not to do it due to lack of justification or explanation. If the government has not done it, it could be because they there is no need for it to do it. Similarly, if the government has done it before, it will not necessary do it again when other person is involved. As I said, to do or not to do is based on one reason alone – expediency.
Finding your comments “obtuse”? Sorry its the most polite word I can think of. The rest are not mentionable.
Re #38, thats why I say it is possible (slim chances) but not likely, not likely because for all the pattern of behaviour involving arbitrariness, selective prosecution etc that all can see, even now, the line of re-activating something like Chua’s case over a long time/silence/inaction will be the “first” crossing even the line of perceived arbitrariness. Arguing further on this is pedantic. When drawing a human it appears to one sucjh as you one must draw the intestines, the warts moles the shingles and the piles for you to come to awareness (even if you were to be gracious enough to admit it) that the drawing is about a person!
See the irony here: For me if you want to draw a human, an outline will do, it is for you that we need to draw intestines, moles and what not. You are just trying to be unnecessary “sophisticated” after dropping yourself into a sh!t hole, sorry.
///For me if you want to draw a human, an outline will do, it is for you that we need to draw intestines, moles and what not.”
If mere reversing what I said about you (to apply to me) is the best you could offer by way of response to my posting #40, then there’s no need for me to comment further to hog the blog’s bandwidth.
Its a kind of lazy copying by rote what the other said, and then just switching expediently the positions. Why Cintanegara & Kassim samat can do better. Ha ha ha.
Why the fuss about MCA? They are zeros; so is MIC! They can stand upside-down for all we care.