Posted on by Kit

A vote for Pakatan is a vote against corruption

by Thomas Lee

The Bagan Pinang by-election on Oct 11 is an opportunity for the voters to tell the Braisan Nasional in no uncertain term that the practice of corruption and cronyism must be wiped out in the country. They must go all out to ensure the defeat of the Umno candidate.

By fielding a candidate suspended by his own party for corrupt practice, the Barisan Nasional is obviously snubbing the people, indicating that it couldn’t care less about what they think and feel. It is a de facto endorsement of corrupt practices.

By nominating such a tainted candidate for the Bagan Pinang by-election, the purported high moral ground on which the Umno leaders have been self-righteously proclaiming has been exposed as a mere hollow sinking ground.

Umno is arrogantly confident and cocksure that it will win the Bagan Pinang battle even with a corruption-contaminated candidate.

The voters of Bagan Pinang must come out in full force to show Umno through the ballot box that the days of its exaggerated sense of superiority are numbered.

It is time the Barisan Nasional be told that:

— it cannot simply grab power by unethical and illegal means, like what had happened in Perak;

— it cannot simply use oppressive laws like the ISA to silence its critics, opposition leaders and the freedom and human right crusaders;

— it cannot simply use harsh enforcement on peaceful unarmed demonstrators and candlelight protestors;

— it cannot simply change the education system at its whims and fancy every other few years, causing confusion among the teachers, parents and students, and creating chaos in the schooling system;

— it cannot simply continue to control and manipulate the press and mass media to promote its own causes, and to run down the opposition and critics;

— it cannot simply allow the corrupt political leaders to go unpunished, especially those using public funds for private holidays to Disneyland and those living beyond their means in great luxury in multi-million ringgit mansions;

— it cannot simply allow investigation into the mysterious death of political aide Teoh Beng Hock to be frustrated by attempts to prevent relevant persons from testifying;

— it cannot simply cover up scandals involving public projects such the PKFZ issue.

Will the voters of Bagan Pinang take the lead and send the message to Umno and the Barisan Nasional that “Enough is Enough” and it’s “Time for Change”?

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68 Replies to “A vote for Pakatan is a vote against corruption”

  1. Yes, Mr. Thomas, we must keep educating and convincing our voters that enough is enough. To your list of abuses and misdeeds, may I add that they cannot continue to create mountains of bureaucracy and adding layers after layers of incompetency and efficiency into the administration. They cannot treat the coffer of this rich country like their own personal bank account. They can not formulate policies and government programmes at their own whim and fancy. The quality of life of most Malaysians is fast becoming like those living in a third world country – poor water and air quality, filthy environment, lack of public infrastructure and amenities, congestion, dilapidating housing, poor security, low quality education and health care, and increasing income disparity. Yes, many have earned more and that is because we have continued to think in nominal terms.

  2. “A vote against corruption”
    Nice rhetoric, but to many Malaysians “a vote against corruption” is also “a vote against my way of life” or “a vote that will bite the hand that feeds me” or “a vote that will make my financial cleansing service less profitable”.

    Pakatan Rakyat haven’t done bad out of complaining about the obvious and plentiful abuses of the incumbents, but what positive benefits are on the table? I don’t mean ‘what positive benefits’ for PR supporters, but for the residents of Bagan Pinang?

    I wish I could read the PAS website – it always seems to be the best-looking one out of the 3 PR parties! Would it be only a positive move if PAS made their website content available in other languages? Or would that defeat their purpose?

  3. “It cannot……it cannot…..it cannot……” But it CAN, and with impunity and with arrogance because it controls everything.

    Neutralise the control part and everything will fall. Create chaos in their machinery and apparatus. BN parties are all having internal problems and can easily collapse if you find the right weak spots.

  4. Umno Baru is supreme, n what UmnoB wants, UmnoB gets
    Corruption is a small issue to UmnoB
    Who among Umnoputras is not corrupt? None
    Melaka MB still MB, though not clean n found guilty
    MCA, MIC, Gerakan, etc – too full of corrupt ppl
    Anyway, these beggars don’t have any choice
    Support, dance, wag tails – yes master, will do
    Umnoputras after meeting in Janda Baik will give them the final solution
    Also, EC coming out with new rules
    To block PR component parties to support PAS candidate openly
    David vs Goliath – siapa win the war n battle

  5. The issue in bagan is how to get the right message across to the postal voters. I believe that by securing something like 33% of those votes umno’s advantage (in the postal votes) could neutralised. Indians there could be swayed by the cow head incident. But the umno gobermen saw it fit to prohibit all mention of that incident. Nonetheless, they could still be angry. Chinese generally distrust umno and they are likely to throw their votes against umno even if it means supporting pas. What is more, umno picked a badly tainted candidate and expects the people to support him. Overall I see a good chance/possibility of pakatan wrestling the constituency from umno’s grasp. It would be close.

  6. A vote against UMNO is not just only about…. against corruptions.
    It is much more than that.
    It is stealing tax payers money and National wealth to tell Malays…UMNO is helping them…with is infact stealing from their own race..and give to chosen few.
    Mahathir said…UMNO help so many Malays to study overseas…and some are ungrateful…voting against UMNO…sums up UMNO mentalities.
    Mamak is the ring leader to fool Malays..divide them too.
    UMNO have gone too far with their arrogance and bragging mentalities…not forgetting…these daylight robbers have no principles in life at all.
    Latest news is UMNO thinking to field much more UMNO candidates in 13th GE..blaming MCA,..MIC and Gerakan for the 12th GE poor results.
    MCA…MIC and Gerakan were voted out…..dead and buried….all because of UMNO non stop fooling Malaysians..spearheaded by Mahathir and on going. 12th GE was votes against Mahathir………more than anything else.
    Thousansds of Muslims…know now……..UMNO’s downfall is due mainly on Mahathir…hypocracy and encouraging.. massive corruptions.
    Barisan is just a window dressing show…all powerless..true disgrace to other races…they so call are representing.
    It has always been personal benefits plus chosen few to enrich themselves.
    These are not politicians. These are parasites and leeches…depending on UMNO to get rich and survive.
    UMNO knows Muslims are getting more and more hating them…and UMNO needS to keep finding scapegoats…to pray and hope….Muslims believe in them…and give UMNO… another chance.
    Ordinary muslims…have no race issues.
    Najib know that too well…thus the
    “1Malaysia” is infact trying to please the Malays…saying UMNO have no race issues too.
    Clear double standards applied…yet “1Malaysia” promoted.
    Najib depend desperately on Malay voters….and it will be Muslims…that are getting fed up with UMNO wayang kulit…..spoiling the good name of the Islamic religion too.
    So many reasons for Muslims to vote UMNO out…and Bagan Pinang will be a good test for these voters.

  7. A vote for PR equals a vote against corruption is a strong theme but it is obvious that UMNO is confident that corruption is not a deterent agains the deeply ingrained fear of losing Malay privileges if PR comes into power. Therefore the focus should also be strongly on dispelling this perception among the Malays. Remove that fear and UNMO’s platform will collapse. Does PR have enough conviction to BELIEVE that Bagan Pinang can be won?

  8. As Malays being the dominant race in Malaysia, the Malay voters in Bagan Pinang must lead the way to show the minority races that we are all Malaysians; that for love of country and for the sake of the future generation we must stand united to vote out the present corrupt and cruel regime led by UMNO Baru. Tell BN ENOUGH IS ENOUGH.

  9. Now is the time for our Malay braders in Bagan Pinang to show that the Islamic religion is not what UMNO Baru have made it out to be. Materialistic and corrupt, telling lies to fool rakyat including own race, committing murders and swearing on the Holy Quaran without truely fearing ALLAH YANG MAHA MULIA ………

    Earn the respect of non-muslims by voting against corruption to show that good muslims abhors all forms of corruptions and pleasure seeking. VOTE PR’s PAS candidate.

  12. monsterball is right. A vote against umno is a vote against thefts and robberies.

    So far pakatan’s turf has remained firmly with pakatan. At least it could be said that if there is any erosion in pakatan’s support at all, it is not significant. The by-election results so far are clear testimonies of this fact. In fact pakatan gained ground in wining a seat (i.e. KT) which previously occupied by umno.

    Bagan can be seen as a real test of umno’s support – whether umno has lost ground. We all know that umno has indeed lost some grounds. Umno too realises it. The question is how much was lost. Is it enough to result in a decisive swing of support in favour of pakatan? Almost certainly a yes but it would be a close run to finish line.

    Mic and mca are not able to sing and dance anymore even if assuming that they can still attract a crowd now. The mental burden on them simply robs them of all energy and interest.

    Malay voters must be made to realise the deceptions played out by umno and the many struggles which umno claimed was engaged in the name and for the benefit of the malay race. In umno’s dictionary malays actually means umnoputras and nothing else. By simple deduction, to them non-umnoputra malays (police and members of the armed forces included) are the same as non-malays.

    Soldiers are tasked to protect the country, her land, her people and her autonomy. Our lands have been treated as if they are privitely owned land belonging to umno. Our people were arrested and detained and even killed without reasons or justifications. There are no automony to talk about. Umno is the lord of the country and everyone else is their slave. So do your duty soldiers. Protect the country. Vote against umno.

  14. “The quality of life of most Malaysians is fast becoming like those living in a third world country .>>.” limkamput

    Which rock have you been living under?? Malaysia IS a third world country!

  16. PR n PAS should print posters for distribution to voters there
    “Umno Baru truly arrogant & almighty
    Treating BP voters as fools & serfs
    Nah, here’s ISA, our best candidate
    Though guilty of corruption & against Islam, so what?
    Good for you, good for NS
    Choose him”

  18. This coming BP buy election offers great opportunities
    For young people, esp those in universities, to study and analyze
    The lies, hypocritical statements, illogical support statements
    Made by BN politicians
    To beautify a well known n confirmed corrupt politician as a saint
    Black becomes sparkling white
    The best case study of utterly pathetic unscrupulous politicians with no principles in action

  20. ///Umno is arrogantly confident and cocksure that it will win the Bagan Pinang battle even with a corruption-contaminated candidate.///– Thomas Lee

    I believe that UMNO will win and prove once again that their divide-and-rule policy works. Under that formula, the persons who rule the country has more rights to national resources than the ordinary people. That is accepted because the persons who are going to vote UMNO candidate knew that under UMNO they continue to gain privilege treatment over non-Malays, and that counts. They have not been informed, or if so informed, they are yet to be convinced that UMNO made their income lower despite the special treatments, through corruption of people in high places, and inefficiency in government administration. The results of brainwash since NEP days condition them to believe that Bangsa and Ugama are the only thing they live for in this life, and heaven, for the life after.

    Sabah and Sarawak would have been much more prosperous if their resources have been kept for their own development. The people there somehow have not come out to prove to UMNO that enough is enough.

    UMNO have fooled half the population in the country, and with that they have enough votes to remain in power. MIC under a new chief will be working with new Indian-BN-bound parties, and serve UMNO needs: one Indian minister will do Indians proud. The prouder Indians like Mahathir are Malays.

    CSL is certainly waiting for the right time to form another Chinese-BN-bound party absorbing all those who had gained benefits as members of MCA. So in Peninsular Malaysia, UMNO with the support of UMNO-moles embedded in PAS would continue to rule. MACC together with the support of some royal houses who declared that people should support BN government will again return UMNO to power. That is the fate of Malaysians.

  21. //That is the fate of Malaysians.// Loh

    This is defeatist. This is hopelessness that UMNO has successfully inculcated in many of us. How can this be? The battle has not even begun, but we already have all kinds of doom expressed. Come on, democracy is also about ideas and convincing the voters of new ideas, new approaches and new paradigm. During period 1963 to 65, the country has nearly become a multiracial, multi-cultural and multi lingual society with a government that was decent, effective and honest. We failed then, and of course with subsequent depraved indoctrination, the country has become what it is today. Yes, the nation’s demography has changed but that does not preclude us from embarking again the journey to build an effective government. We shall prevail, for this is what politics is all about. How can we postulate we will lose the Bagan Pinang seat when the campaign has hardly started? This is stupid, we may as well not contest.

  22. I WILL BE THERE..a tiny speck of hope I intend to be…for millions.
    Returning home..whatever the result maybe..I can feel proud I walk the talks…and doing my best.
    Yes…I will be there ….to support PR and PAS.

  23. Slaves or tie-coons by the nose?

    So let us recap. They have got three chinese towkays…one a Tan Sri and two Datuks who have all beniftted from Isa’s era as MB of Negri Sembilan – to volunteer to help them in Bagan Pinang. As Najib and Isa have told these three – it is pay back time. They have made their money from business opportunities given to them by Barisan now it is time to donate towards Isa’s cause. [see below]

    Joshua says and so ‘pay back time’ is endless. Has not these three cronies being paying the UMNO’s warlords their share of ill gotten gains of taxpayers for the 22 years Isa was Menteri Besar? If that had not happen, how did Isa had the means to bribe party delegates of millions of Ringgit for high position as money politics conviction. Ask Tun Mahathir – he must knows it all happening even in his time.

    Joshua Kong
    PM for IGGG.

    Bagan Pinang. One Tan Sri. Two Datuks. (UPDATED WITH BM TRANSLATION)
    Posted by admin http://mt.m2day.org/2008/content/view/27429/84/
    Friday, 02 October 2009 21:13
    By Steadyaku47

    pw: choice recent

  24. Kerajaan Hong Kong Rampas Wang Musa Aman?
    Posted by admin

    http://mt.m2day.org/2008/content/view/27401/84/
    Thursday, 01 October 2009 19:11
    (TV Antara) – Ketua Angkatan Muda Keadilan Shamsul Iskandar Md Akin berlepas ke Hong Kong sebentar tadi untuk mendesak Badan Pencegah Rasuah Hong Kong menyoal siasat sekutu Ketua Menteri Sabah Musa Aman berhubung kes penyeludupan dan pengurupan wang RM16juta.

    Penangkapan Michael ini memberi tamparan hebat kepada Ketua Pengarah BPR, Datuk Seri Ahmad Said Hamdan kerana desas desus yang tersebar meluas mengatakan bahawa Kes Rasuah Loh Man Heng telah ditutup berikutan pengakuan Loh Man Heng sendiri bahawa beliau telah membayar sejumlah RM4 juta melalui pegawai kanan BPR, Mohd Jamidan Abdullah yang sebelum ini menutup kes Musa Aman dalam kegiatan pembalakan haram di Keningau.

    pw: honored scram

  25. I’M FELT SO SORRY FOR THOSE MIDDLE AND BELOW INCOME RAKYAT SUFFER IN THEIR DAILY HASSLE STUCK IN TRAFFIC JAM. BN SPENDING SO MUCH PUBLIC FUND AND YET THE RAKYAT BEAR THEIR ILL GOTTEN PROJECT FOREVER. ESPECIALLY TO RAKYAT WHO LIVE IN AMPANG, MORNING STUCK EVENING STUCK. LRT UNABLE REACH INNER PART, KTM FAIL TO DELIVER TO THE NEEDS OF RAKYAT. WAHT IS THE USE TWIN TOWER STANDING SO TALL?

  27. “We were third world, we made some progress materially, but now we are back to third world …>>> limkamput

    If you are not a member of the OECD or a nonOECD with high income then you are a third world country.

    So according to you, Malaysia was a third world country, then Malaysia achieved developed status … and then Malaysia went back to becoming a third world country??

    When did Malaysia ever leave the status of a third world country? When Mahathir built the Petronas Towers? You are a twat, admit it.

  29. Dear YB Lim,
    ringthetill is Correct Correct Correct. Like many parents who tell their children to get good result and do not follow it up with how to get the good results we have been telling the present government to get rid of corruption withot telling them what and how and get them to do it. General Elections is one way. But that is a long not practical.I would like to start with restitution. Whatever you take must be returned first and then a Departmrntal Fine should be imposed for first time offenders. Subsequent offences should mean double the amount you took after you have made restitution. And so on. Criminal charges must be filed against those repeat offenders. Three strikes and you are out. No compromise. That means we will be practical but imperfect. Here we must use extreme methods because they will be perfect.

    Presently, Government Officers can be surcharged for excessive claims or for approving purchase of office supplies at two or three times the retail price. Heads of Department must be told that they should not abdicate their responsibility and be instructed to carry this out. This is a job for the KSN. All the administrative powers are vested in him. He has the powers to do it and do whatever it takes with the approval of the cabinet.

    Many countries use this instrument to control corruption. The private sector also does this to control abuse or theft of company funds. I am confident that if these simple steps are taken we will clear the way to bring to books those who have been pesistently abusing public funds. There is no need for a Royal Commission or new laws to take on this matter.

  30. I did not say Malaysia has achieved developed status. I said Malaysia did make some progress materially, i.e. in terms of income and wealth creation. But in terms of mentality, political institutions, social and quality of life we are still very much third world. There is no need to split hair; you know what I meant in my initial posting, i.e. in many respects instead of making further progress we are degenerating and retrogressive. If you want to find fault, that is another matter.

  31. Moderator, I would appreciate if you could take note who is starting all the nonsense here again. What is twat? Do you think it is justifiable for him to use it on me for no good reason?
    When all the insults are thrown at me, you don’t seem to take notice. The moment I retaliate, you will take immediate action to moderate me. Anyway, a person who keeps changing his/her handle is spineless, dishonest and conceited.

  33. “In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.” – Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
    Trolling does not have to resort to slang like “twat”. It can be done by refine language of standard English!

    Whether a posting is “controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic” “provoking other users into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion” is adjudged by the content/context of what is posted in entirety. Hence a person can “troll” even if he uses standard English without a single derogatory slang word.

    For illustrations:-

    Loh in his posting #20 on October 3rd, 2009 17:46 has expressed an opinion how UMNO by virtue of certain factors will prevail in its political domination. It is not an assessment that many will like here, and most assuredly not even him but it may well be a “realistic” assessment based on current facts. So what is the justification for LimKamPut to say this is “defeatist”, “this is “stupid”, we may as well not contest….”???

    Based on a given set of facts, Loh’s assessment may be described as “realistic” but if one does not agree, does it mean it is “defeatist” and “stupid”???

    Take another example of the thread “A vote for Pakatan is a vote against corruption”.

    The same poster in his posting #40 on October 2nd, 2009 17:49 came out of the blues and said “by the way I was the first one to mention the Financial Procedure Act and someone has subsequently written eloquently on it without given me the due acknowledgement. Before that there was no mention of this act at all by this person. In fact, he even said that letters of support, if properly worded, could actually be letters of guarantee. I just want to keep the record straight.” Is this posting relevant?

    Then what about posting #45 by limkamput on September 17th, 2009 16:52 under thread page 1 of “ Cleaning up the Judiciary – was the Chief Justice right?” where this was posted – “Orangrojak, that is why you are not a referee because obviously you do not know who is winning. And please write proper English here because we Malaysians read and write standard English, unlike the poorly educated class from UK”…

    Don’t such posts written in standard English without slang like “twat” but judging by their content and choice of words qualify to be “controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic message” intended to provoke an emotional response from ones against whom such a post was obliquely directed causing disruption of online discussion?

  34. Therefore the assessment whether a posting is trolling is not just based on use of slang like “twat” or other unsavoury terms littering blogosphere. It is adjudged by the whole content of the posting and choice of words.

    My point here is that I can customarily “troll” here using the best Queens English and the most polite language – without using a single slang or unsavoury word – to put other posters down!

    If other posters use “twat” on me because of my habitual making of controversial, inflammatory, irrelevant or off-topic posts provoking emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion – and to stop my trolling, albeit by using polite language- are the other posters trolling, and my taking them to task feeding the troll? Can a troll feed a troll? I thought the first troll was getting his just deserts!

  35. Jeffrey, I was appealing to the moderator, not you. You are not a judge here. You are an interested party who felt small because I have commented on your posting before. I did not attack you personally, but I said was the truth. The truth hurts am I right? What I said on the Financial Procedure Act earlier was about right. As for comments on Loh’s posting, I sincerely believe that it was a fair comment to use the word defeatist and stupid in that context. I did not say he was stupid. I said the comment was defeatist and stupid. In any case, is it your business to defend him? You don’t even know you are biased. You pick me to quarrel with you. I know your intention: to get me moderated so that your opinions can hold sway in this blog again. I think I am right about that.

    As for all other things said earlier, it was said in retaliation to uncalled comments thrown at me. I could also say in numerous occasions you together with Jaswant (now probably Hugos) have used all kinds of personal attacks like being delusional, sick, Tanjung Rambutan, Tampoi, forget medication etc. on me. If you think my comment is not true or fair, debate me. There is no need to divert to other stuff.

    Orang Rojak, I do not know what is your intention of putting the link here to define the word “twat”. May be you want everybody to know how I am described here. I will try not to feed the troll, but I can’t promise.

  36. hahahahahaha…Everyone needs a lesson or two from the smartest and most well informed visitor here.
    LKS had some lessons from him too……hahahahahahaha
    Imagine….visiting somebody’s house and teaching the host…how to be fair…….hahahahahaha
    Don’t like..just leave..why talk so much.
    If like…respect the decisions of the blog owner.
    Cannot understand this simple rule…want to teach others?….hahahahahahahaha
    Sensitive and confused….blame this and that too.

  37. A vote for Pakatan is a vote against corruption.

    And a vote for BN is a vote for corruption. Makes sense? Yes, good sense.

    So, I hear a deluge of anti-ISA badges will flood the streets in Bagan Pinang. Good for democracy. Very good for Keadilan (Justice). Fantastic timing for Anti-ISA.

  38. A vote for Pakatan is first and foremost..a vote to …change an overdue party to govern the country..who is dictatorial…apply double standards and want to divide Malaysians..to apply….divide to rule..the out-dated cruel ways of the past British government policy.
    UMNO corruptions are sucking blood from the poor.
    Corruptions is everywhere in the world.
    How big or how serious it is…is what Malaysians are concern about. We are no fools.

  39. ‘Dear voters in Bagan Pinang, it’s never a better time to prove the rakyat’s worth as right-thinking Malaysians than now. Teach the arrogant folks in BN a severe lesson in humility in this by-election.’ so said Malaysiakini.

    This was the easy part. The hard part is to get this message across and get our people enlightened.

  40. Was there a deliberate “divide and rule” policy by the British? I know that was what most people said, but was there a deliberate policy? Or was it more of “economic expediency” when the British found it most convenient to have the Indians working in the estates, the Chinese in tin mining and retailing and Malays in their leisurely padi fields. The British did not divide the people into Bumiputra and non Bumiputra. The British did try to help the Malays, but the help was seldom abused or misused. The British tried to form the Malay Union to give equal rights and opportunities to all but it was “us” who refused it. The British did not insist we must form our political parties based on race en-route to independence. The British tried to keep Singapore within Malaysia, but it was us who worked covertly without the knowledge of the British to dismantle it. I wish historians could show me where exactly the British have deliberately tried to divide and rule.

  41. ///I said the comment was defeatist and stupid. In any case, is it your business to defend him?///– Limkamput

    I appreciate what Jeffrey has written. It was not a defense as if I needed support. I thought it was obvious that the comments were uncalled for, and I did not bother to dignify the comments. But it was good of Jeffrey to quote that as an example, and I am sure he has every right on this issue.

  42. Jeffrey has every right on this issue. You too has every right on this issue. I believe I also have every right on this issue. Yes, your comment on the political situatioin in Malaysia was defeatist and stupid, that was my comment.

  43. As Loh said, my comments were not a defense of him as if he needed support. There are those like him who would not dignify an uncalled for remark or trolling. However there are those others who would be provoked to an emotional response and end up getting into arguments/mutual recriminations disrupting normal on-topic discussion in this blog. Yes I am not judge here but just as Lim KJam Put has the right to appeal to the moderator, I am also addressing my comments to the Moderator of what constitutes “troll” so that he/she could appreciate the bigger picture and be fair and moderate in his/her determination.

    In context of what OrangRojak posted, it may give an impression that trolling means just using derogatory slang like “twat” when what I want to emphasize is that trolling is adjudged objectively by what is written in entirety and may take place with the best standard English without a single slang or vulgar term.

    In fact according to definition of “twat” posted by OrangRojak it can, depending on context, be even used as “endearing” term.

    Unfortunately, in selecting illustrations of how trolling could, judging by context, take place even in standard English without a single slang or vulgarity, it just happened that Lim Kam Put’s postings taken are most apt for illustration of my point. It is also convenience. This blog is replete with such examples, easy to just scroll over and there are ample pluckings!

  45. Oh yes, Jeffrey, your idea on democracy (on how a majority has spoken and there is nothing we can do about it) in the other thread was to me defeatist also. Let’s focus on the substance of posting. Please don’t create distractions if you can’t fight me on substance. Oh, the eloquent posting about the Financial Procedure Act, I don’t even know to laugh or to cry, so much of intellectual honesty being thrown here.

  46. Its more than just a vote against corruption. Its actually a vote for the future – not just for this country, but for Malays, for everyone.

    Basically the voters have to decide whether they will vote for short term personal gains that may or may not be possible whatever the dire consequences is for everyone includign themselves especially in the long term OR do they vote for a longer term future, independence, their self-pride, better character and better foundation. There is no future in what is being proposed here with the election of Isa – no future for this country, no future for people, not even a future for UMNO and the Malays.

    Electing Isa will merely delay the problems and cost more to everyone eventually to fix it. A vote for PR is to move the solution forward – for everyone including those in Bagan Pinang..

  47. what is your intention
    Just trying to be helpful. I am practically an expert on obscene British slang of the late 20th century.

    It would be nice to have something concrete to offer die-hard BN voters, wouldn’t it? Both sides have dearly-held negative views of the other. I’m not convinced the ‘vote against’ argument is superior to UMNO’s ‘vote against’ argument. Given ‘vote against corruption’, against ‘vote against idiot Islamists handing your glorious fatherland over to greedy Chinese pendatangs, all led by a vengeful sodomite traitor – and you can kiss goodbye to your patronage’, are we really expecting the traditional UMNO voter to be swayed?

    This is perhaps the greatest weakness in Pakatan Rakyat. The failure to come together as a unit (1Opposition!) and develop a clear strategy for Malaysia’s future forces you to keep harping on the other side’s weaknesses. I’m not convinced the lifelong ‘support the government voter’ can see the difference – let alone the benefit – in voting PR.

    I think Bagan Pinang voters should vote PR just for change’s sake. Unbroken access to privileged positions makes people lazy and careless. It’s time to give them a rest.

  48. Najis is caught between a rock and a hard place. If he doesn’t accede to Isa’s wishes, there is a chance that Isa’s supporters will sabotage BN’s candidate, whoever that might be. So Najis is taking the practical view that he must win at all costs – similar to his recent Perak strategy. Najis needs to win first and worry about the consequences later. If he loses this buy-election, it could be the start of a slippery slope to oblivion.

  49. Limkamput, I won’t respond to your posting #45 on Financial Procedure Act etc. To do so would engage this thread on a matter irrelevant to the thread, which is unfair to both blog & readers and ENDANGERED HORNBILL will once again have to suggest (legitimately) that such arguments be taken to another private forum!

    On the matter related to this thread, I’d just comment a little on what ENDANGERED HORNBILL said about if “a vote for Pakatan is a vote against corruption”, then a vote for BN is a vote for corruption. Makes sense? Yes, good sense”…

    Here we have to look at the idea of “corruption”, how narrow or wide one attributes to it. ENDANGERED HORNBILL refers to corruption of political kind, ie political corruption. It is not confined to just bribery and kickbacks or giving moneys to delegates/voters. In the widest sense, it covers for example favoring supporters and those who vote for a candidate with ‘special’ favours, an exchange which becomes illegitimate when all citizentry/tax payers are entitled equally to these favours, regardless whether they vote for one or not. For examples if I say the exchange is – if you vote for me I’ll bring development to your area ie bridges, schools etc or if you continue to vote for me I’ll perpetuate your priviledges and entitlement based on race. This kind of promises is illegitimate because all citizentry/tax payers are entitled equally to these favours ie development and no racial discrimination regardless whether they vote for you or not.

    Yet this exchange is what the ruling coalition is offering on the table for majority of voters in Bagan Pinang to bite….One can call such an offer political corruption or feudal patronage exchange or any other term, but the fact is this offer of an amalgam of ideas comprising Ketuanan/ selective development in exchange for votes and support with one eye closed to the sheninegans of political elites has been going on for more than 50 years witnessing UMNO/BN political domination. So how far does 308 tsunami indicate change in majority’s attitude, extending even to a traditional UMNO stronghold like Bagan Pinang? That’s the question! An appeal to race is an appeal to primodial insecurities. For race not to count at least more than depredations of one’s elected leaders/officials, the majority of voters have to be matured, like what Godfather commented. However one cannot be sanguine that the basic exchange above has diminished in influence and marching to oblivion. Orang Rojak has stated this clearly : “I’m not convinced the lifelong ’support the government voter’ can see the difference – let alone the benefit – in voting PR. I think Bagan Pinang voters should vote PR just for change’s sake.” This is exactly how the existing system perpetuates itself – if “unbroken access to privileged positions makes people lazy and careless” then, the calculations are that people used to them will continue to have insecurities in relation to others, and therefore will vote for a system assuring continuance of the “unbroken access to privileged positions”, never mind that it incurs the downside of leaders being not up to mark, propriety and integrity. An assessment of that might well hold true is realistic and should not be denounced “defeatist” or “stupid”.

  50. PR should get hold of Angela Yam to sing “Chua SL, you don’t buy me flowers anymore” during their ceramah. This will remind the voters of the type of cheapskate leaders that are in BN today.

  51. Look, I don’t care if it’s financial corruption or political corruption, I don’t care if we are trolls or twats, or if we use Queen’s English or broken Engrish. All I care is how we pass on the message that we must vote for change. Even if PR loses this time, we must show that the voters have continued to mature, and that this is Najis’ one and only term in office.

  53. One has look at the objective facts when seeking to describe something.

    For example, a man acts in a certain way based on his habit or convictions. He will not change, whatever you tell him. These are the facts. However people don’t describe the facts as they are (neutrally) – that he does not change habit or behaviour. They also put in their emotions into their words describing that man. If they believe in his convictions, they’ll describe him as “firm”, if not he’s “obstinate/stubborn”, if they are diametrically opposed to his convictions, then he is described as “pigheaded.” Either way the words used – whether firm, obstinate/stubbon or pigheaded – don’t often throw objective light on what the man really is. They just show where the bias/emotions of the person(s) describing the man lie judging from their choice of words.

    Hence in Bagan Pinang a candidate found by his own party as guilty for money politics can be “good guilty” (as if guilty were not guilty) because he never disparaged and acted against his party’s interest just because it found him guilty of money politics. One can also extrapolate to say a person guilty of money politics is also “good guilty” if he ‘shares’ like Robin Hood his money and take care of party or some constituents with it. But is it permissible to twist words this fashion as if telling the objective truth when its far from it?

    Like in this blog, just because a poster makes an assessment, which if reasoned and backed by logic and experience, may be described as realistic, can another poster, who emotionally does like the assessment and its inevitable conclusion, just summarily say and reiterate that that assessment is “defeatist” and “stupid” and thinks he can get away with it just because he is condemning the other’s comment, as distinct from the commentator himself as “defeatist” and “stupid” as if there’s a world wide of a big difference in such a case when the derogatory description is based on an emotional rather than a reasoned and intellectual response?

  54. While people battle about words here
    Umnoputras had oledi started the most unscrupulous n racist war in BP
    Racist books were distributed to stir up tribal racist instincts
    Divide, divide n rule
    Umno n BN’s message, loud n clear:
    Malays must only trust n vote for corrupt Malays who preserve ketuanan Melayu
    Malays must only trust n vote for corrupt Malays who only cakap 1M’sia but do not practise 1M’sia
    Malays must not trust and vote for Malays who believe in n act fairly towards Malaysian M’sia
    Voters in BP must take $$$ offered by Umnoputras n their cronies (Bumi n non-Bumi)
    And then vote against Umno

  55. //Racist books were distributed to stir up tribal racist instincts//.

    What else to campaign on? If religion, the PAs candidate has arguably better credentials. If financial probity, well the BN candidate had been found guilty by his own party of money politics (mitigated ostensibly by him being “good guilty”).

    So the only remaining card is race even if it contradicts the top leader’s “1 Malaysia”!

    This (Bagan Pinang) is a very crucial by election. If BN ever loses, it will not recover its confidence. If it wins (not marginally but truimphantly) it means, race is still, after 50 years of independence, a crucial factor that overrides downside of manifestly poor credential leaders. It will be a signal to Pakatan Rakyat that its upholding of multi racial Malaysia, as a principle, will militate against it in many areas where the “exchange system” offerred by BN is still very much alive and kicking.

  57. Thank you Orang Rojak for being helpful. I agree that we should focus on the strategy and on how to turn things around given our present less than comfortable situation. It is pointless to state on one hand and on the other hand all the time. We all know it is depraved indoctrination that UMNO has used and reused since the beginning of this country. If we accept this as fait accompli, then UMNO has won. This is what some bloggers here want us to believe – we have to “realistically” accept that we are scr*wed. That I think is illogical.

    A patronage system cannot favour the majority. A patronage system can only favour the well connected and the privileged; otherwise it is not a patronage. If the people of Bagan Pinang have continued to support a corrupted system, that is not because they have benefitted meaningfully from such a system. It is because they are ignorant and victims of depraved indoctrination. During 1963-65, the country nearly made a break but it failed. We are now trying again, and try we must till we succeed.

  58. OrangRojak:

    Passing on the message by whatever meagre means at our disposal – keep ramming the message home through the alternative media, leaflets, seminars, etc. Those who have financial means should contribute and as we head towards a 2 party (or 2 coalition) system, there’s no reason why corporates should not be encouraged to contribute to PR.

  59. One of the things that has mystified me over the years is the lack of advertising capability of the Opposition parties. Granted that the mainstream press won’t accept your paid adverts, but what about billboards, posters and pamphlets ? Can’t we flood the streets with posters that say “A Vote for BN is a Vote for Corruption ” with Isa’s face as the backdrop ? How about “Remember PKFZ ?” or “Say Enough to Stealing”. I mean the Ah Longs and the pimps can flood the streets with their adverts, and we can’t ?

  60. Political struggle is not like selling ice cream, i.e. even if you don’t believe in the ice cream you still can sell it. Political struggle is about belief and way of life we hold dear. We must have conviction before we can embark on it. I notice some people have the tendency to justify the status quo even though the status quo is hopeless and disgusting. Alternatively, some people would say that the present situation is unchangeable because the ruling party is too strong or the system too entrenched. If that is the case, may I know what is the point of having opposition parties participating in constitutional struggle. I am sure opposition parties would never want to stay opposition forever. All political parties harbour intention to rule the country someday. I think it is not just the rural or less educated people that got indoctrinated. I think the so-called intellectuals too are also victims of UMNO indoctrination and inculcation machine. Yes, I am the tuan, I have more rights and you are just a pendatang, a serf, and you better work hard so that I can tax more and spend more.

  61. Sometimes I feel as though there aren’t any actual DAP members posting on this blog. Is there a leaflet campaign in Bagan Pinang? It seems as though it would be child’s play to coordinate one online – I don’t understand why it’s not visible. Shouldn’t there be neighbourhoods allocated via Google Maps, local supporters each printing 50 or 100 4-leaflet pages, dropping them at the nearest DAP/PAS/PKR office, for people who don’t look like apparent foreigners to put into mailboxes?

    I guess there might be a local plan that involves a local printer and local distribution company, but I would still expect to be dimly aware of a design for a leaflet. But nothing – nothing is curious! Anybody got reassurance?

  62. Yes, Limkamput not only they are victims, these people refuse to Change. They still have the mentality that they are the Tuans now and forever! Simply because change has a ripping effect on those who won’t let go, change isn’t for cowards. Bagan Pinang voters must take the lead and go all out to ensure the defeat of the Umno candidate. I am eager to know the result next week

  63. For far too long, the BN, especially UMNO, has been foisting rubbish on the electorate and they have been lapping it up!!
    Now, they have grown so bold as to field one sullied candidate after another and expect the electorate to give them vote to them!
    Only the dumbest of the dumb voters will allow such brazenness to go unchallenged!!
    Never give another vote to UMNO/BN ever again!!!!!

  64. “I mean the Ah Longs and the pimps can flood the streets with their adverts, and we can’t ?”

    Welcome back Godfather.
    You seemed to have forgotten that those who are mentioned by you happened to be loaded!
    By ill gotten gains!
    The opposition can ill afford to flood the streets with anything.
    But all is not lost.
    For a start, all those who posted or visited Uncle Lim’s blog can spread the word, either electronically or by word of mouth.
    The most important thing is to tell others that the electorate MUST STOP voting for those self serving parties.
    Also, never, ever listen to the propaganda published by the MSM that those parties will reform because what they said is for the sake of getting votes! They’ll gladly sell their mothers to do so! Or their sisters for that matter!
    Once the votes are in hand, they’ll ride rough-shod over you AGAIN. And this cycle will keep repeating!
    Remember, what they have done to the nation and its people are unforgivable!!!

  65. When the ruling party knows no shame, that’s when you know that things are really going from bad to worse. Check it now, or it’ll be too late for our children and their children.

  66. Ini adalah peluang demokrasi yang memberikan kita rakyat msia melaksanakan hak kita. Marilah rakyat msia jelata tak kisah samada dilabel “pendatang” atau tidak, undilah untuk masa depan anda:
    1. bebas dari korupsi
    2. Satu Bangsa Msia yang tidak mengira kaum, agama dan bahasa
    3. Satu Bangsa Msia yang maju bersama tidak mengira kaum, agama dan bahasa
    4. Satu Bangsa Msia yang penuh harapan

  67. This is not a case of the ruling party knows no shame
    Umno n BN definitely have no shame n don’t care abt it
    Umno n BN have always been racist parties
    And they are out to create racial discontent, hatred, n panic, esp among Malays
    In order to gain votes from Malays
    They used to use nonMalays as the punching bag n bogeyman to terrify Malays to vote for Umno n BN
    Now they include, in addition to nonMalays, fair-minded Malays who embraced Malaysian Malaysia as traitors of Malays n bogeyman
    Yes, as always, during erection times we see the true ketuanan Melayu color of Umno n BN
    Scruw their meaningless slogans, like 1M’sia
    Scruw MCA, MIC, Gerakan, n other BN component parties for kowtowing to Umno n selling their ancestors against the principle of Malaysian Malaysia

  68. i think it is fair for PR to be given chances to govern since
    we already given at least 50 yrs to the weaklings that never learn to improve

    so i say….we change for better NOT for worse!!
    never trust the 3 scumbags parties

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