By Lim Guan Eng
Hindraf Must Wake Up And Realise That Kampung Buah Pala Is Still Standing Today Because The Penang Pakatan Rakyat State Government Had Successfully Prevented Them From Being Evicted In The Middle Of Last Year.
The Penang Pakatan Rakyat state government has never consented nor approved any demolition of Kampung Buah Pala. Any action taken is by the private developer via a court order issued by the relevant courts.
Up to RM200,000 per family was offered by the developer to the residents which was accepted by many families but not by those remaining in Kampung Buah Pala. The state government respected the decision of those remaining in Kampung Buah Pala to reject any compensation offer and to fight it out in courts.
If the state government had not been sympathetic to the plight of the residents, then the developer would have evicted the residents in the middle of last year when a court order was obtained. Only the determined preventive efforts by Penang DCM2 Professor P Ramasamy and Penang State EXCO Abdul Malek stopped the developer from entering the village with bulldozers several times last year.
All parties must therefore realise that it is only because of the efforts of the present Pakatan Rakyat state government that the Kampung Buah Pala residents are still living there.
Koh Tsu Koon Owes The Public A Full Explanation Why He Sold The Kampung Buah Pala At A Cheap Price Of Only RM10 Per Square Feet In 2007 And Without consulting the residents.
The state government land of Kampung Buah Pala was approved to Koperasi Pegawai Kerajaan Pulau Pinang twice by the BN Penang state EXCO led by Tan Sri Dr Koh Tsu Koon on 18.8.2004 and 8.6.2005 with a premium of RM6.42 million or RM20 per square feet. I can not understand neither the rationale of approving this project without consulting the residents nor selling it at such a low price.
Worse Tan Sri Dr Koh Tsu Koon’s EXCO reduced the premium further by 50% to RM3.21 million or only RM10 per square feet on the recommendation of the UMNO Deputy Chief Minister. Koh Tsu Koon owes the public a full explanation why he sold Kampung Buah Pala at a cheap price of only RM10 per square feet in 2007 when the market price in this prime area is many times over and without consulting the residents.
The Penang State Government Should Not Be Unfairly Victimised And Targeted By Hindraf For Helping The Kampung Buah Pala Residents.
It is BN, Gerakan, MIC, UMNO & MCA that are the main culprits for causing, abandoning and even selling out Kampung Buah Pala residents.
The Penang state government regrets the highly irresponsible and irrational actions of Hindraf in targeting the Penang state government over the actions taken by the developer to evict residents in Kampung Buah Pala. Hindraf wants the state government to act against the court order obtained by the developer to evict the residents. This the state government can not do as Pakatan Rakyat governs under the rule of law and is compelled to respect any court order issued.
On the other hand, there have been suggestions that the Penang state government forcibly acquires the land under for a public purpose under the Land Acquisition Act. Doing so would play into the hands into the developer who would be able to reap enormous profits without putting in a single cent. Much as the Penang state government would wish to do, cancelling the project and forcibly acquiring the land would incur costs beyond the financial capability of the state government. We are NOT talking about millions of ringgit or tens of millions of ringgit here!
Clearly Hindraf is unable to distinguish who its friends are by likening such actions to UMNO’s tearing down of Hindu temple. And yet Hindraf does not organise nation-wide protests for the recent tearing down Hindu temples in Kuala Lumpur. The Penang state government should not be unfairly victimised or targeted by Hindraf when we have assisted the residents and also not involved with the tearing down of any Hindu temple in Penang.
Why is Hindraf not demonstrating against UMNO or Gerakan or MCA or even MIC who are the main culprits and perpetrators behind Kampung Buah Pala? This begs the question whether Hindraf has now been infiltrated by collaborators of MIC and BN when it should be demonstrating against those who demolish temples and not the Penang state government seeking a fair deal for the Kampung Buah Pala villagers.
Hindraf should realise what the Penang state government has done for the Indian community, temples and Tamil primary schools. Not only was the first Indian Deputy Chief Minister II of Penang appointed but the 28 Tamil primary schools were given a yearly allocation of RM1.5 million along with other Chinese primary, Sekolah Agama Rakyat, missionary schools and Chinese independent secondary schools. Further Penang put up the FIRST Tamil road signs in the country alongside with Arabic, Chinese and English bilingual road signs in Georgetown. Even Hindraf never even raised the issue of Tamil road signs.
By going against the Penang state government, Hindraf is indirectly helping UMNO and BN and putting all the achievements made by the Penang state government at risk. There will be no Indian DCM2, no yearly allocation of funds to Tamil primary schools and no more Tamil road signs or bilingual road signs. Hindraf should use reason not emotions of rage or anger and think again who are the real opponents and the real friends of the Indian community.
Most important of all, the Penang state government treats all Indians together with Chinese and Malays as Malaysian citizens, where a Chinese leader can look after Malays a Malay leader can look after Chinese and an Indian leader can look after all citizens. DAP and the Pakatan Rakyat government will not back down or be cowed by BN, UMNO or Hindraf who continues to look at problems from a narrow racial spectrum of Chinese, Indian of Malays. DAP and the Penang Pakatan Rakyat government believes that the issues of Indians are not Indian problems, the issues of Chinese are not Chinese problems nor the issues of Malays not Malay problems but a Malaysian issue.
We should be uniting together as Malaysians around the principles of justice, truth, freedom, democracy and welfare of the people to ensure that we fight corruption to both generate growth and prosperity as well as ensure that everyone shares equitably.
However despite regretting the unwarranted targeting of the Penang state government, Hindraf leaders have the right to exercise the basic human rights of peaceful assembly by demonstrating no matter how unreasonable they are. I have instructed my officials to respect their rights and accept any memorandum submitted in line with non-violent principles of Mahatma Gandhi that, “violence begets violence, an eye for any eye would leave everyone blind.” I also urge the police not to take any action that would lead to untoward actions.
The state government will also not be affected by the actions of the residents in suddenly turning against the state government despite all the assistance offered. The state government will continue to assist the remaining residents of Kampung Buah Pala, including if the residents so wish, that the developer of Kampung Buah Pala continues with its offer of up to RM200,000 compensation per registered family to the residents. The state government has also not given any consent or agreement to the developer to demolish any buildings as the developer is acting on his own under the court order from the High Court and Federal Court.
…..”Government Had Successfully Prevented Them From Been Evicted In The Middle Of Last Year.”
admin
Suggest the word “been” should be replaced with “being”
[admin – thanks]
The video of the press conference by CM Lim held at his office on 29 June 09 is available here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_jmSch5GU24
Why is Hindraf going after the present state govt when it was KTK who sold off Kampung Buah Pala at a cheap price of only RM 10 per square foot In 2007? Is Hindraf afraid that Senator KTK might send Uthayakumar and gang off to Kamunting for 2 years of free holidays? It is a simple case of David Brown gave, but Gerakan took it away.
He’s not his dad is he? LGE always strikes me as having a slight but recurring problem with foot-in-mouth disease.
‘Wake up’ and suggestions of infiltration are unnecessarily pugilistic.
‘Why is Hindraf not demonstrating against [someone who obviously can’t help]?’
Well duh! You are the government of the day! There has been no revolution – you inherited the problems of that office when you won the election. Deal with it!
‘I can not understand’ is never a good choice of argument. OTK used it recently too. You’ll be making people wonder if they should have elected someone who can understand.
‘regrets the highly irresponsible and irrational actions’ is exactlt the sort of thing I’d expect to read from BN, printed in the NST. They’re protesting – just acknowledge their frustration and move on!
‘Clearly Hindraf is unable to distinguish who its friends are’
Oh FFS! You make your friends sign gag orders? Can they even point out spinach between your teeth?
‘There will be no …’
I don’t understand. Is that blackmail?
‘We should be uniting together as Malaysians’
Well you set a good example then, and stop peppering your outburst with racial categories.
‘have the right … no matter how unreasonable they are’
Congratulations, you have blown both feet clean off with one shot.
There are some good points in this article, and it helps me to understand that the problems are not of PR’s making. However, they are the government of the moment, and it is they who must deal with or defuse public outrage. It may not be his fault, but is now and for the foreseeable future, his responsibility. LGE needs someone who is not a raging psychopath to edit his outbursts though, or a ‘working holiday’ to take some courses in Stress- and Anger- Management. He does himself no favours by trying to ‘fight back’, in my opinion.
Problems made by the previous state administration will take umpteen years to resolve. Of course impatient people will blame the current administration, and of course the previous state government will say that they were well on their way to resolving issues for the rakyat.
We face similar problems in Selangor. Files have disappeared. When asked, the state bureaucracy denies any knowledge of what had transpired with the previous administration. People have been waiting for land titles for 13 years, but now with the PR administration, people want the land title issues resolved in 18 months.
Yes, it is an unfortunate fact of life that the government of the day has to answer all questions whether these questions are of their making or not.
I have noticed that, of late, Hindraf have been impulsive and even irrational. It seems to think that Pakatan owes it a living.
Or have MIC infiltrated into Hindraf to break them up?
What Lim Guan Eng (LGE) said – “the Penang Pakatan Rakyat state government has never consented nor approved any demolition of Kampung Buah Pala. Any action taken is by the private developer via a court order issued by the relevant courts” – is true.
State government land of Kampung Buah Pala was approved by then BN Penang state EXCO led by Tan Sri Dr Koh Tsu Koon to be alienated to developer Nusmetro.
Legally, if its state land, BN Penang state EXCO had full legal rights to alienate to anyone that cannot be challenged.
However legal is one thing but state govt. cannot operate independent of political and social concerns. Up to RM 200,000 per family was offered by the developer to the residents which was accepted by many families. RM 200,000 offer is OK and even likely generous when made to people without legal rights in the land.
However for those who refuse the offer it is because money cannot buy and change those who want to preserve it as ‘Tamil Hindu living cultural site’. That is why LGE says, “the state government respected the decision of those remaining in Kampung Buah Pala to reject any compensation offer and to fight it out in courts”.
Here what Hindraf’s P Uthayakumar is agitating (as what I understand him saying) is that whilst he concedes no one expects PR state govt/LGE to flout rule of law to challenge (after alienation of land to Nusmetro) the legality by which previous BN Penang state EXCO alienated (whether for good or bad reasons) to Nusmetro or to deny Nusmetro the legal rights to evict those who have no business on its newly acquired land – the fact is, to Uthayakumar, PR state govt/LGE could also proceed by legality/rule of law to compulsorily acquire back this Kampung Buah Pala land. After all if it’s really a ‘Tamil Hindu living cultural site’, then it fits the bill of public/social purposes for activation of compulsory acquisition.
Here LGE explains: “Doing so would play into the hands into the developer who would be able to reap enormous profits without putting in a single cent. Much as the Penang state government would wish to do, cancelling the project and forcibly acquiring the land would incur costs beyond the financial capability of the state government. We are NOT talking about millions of ringgit or tens of millions of ringgit here!”
This is also true because although Nusmetro may have acquired the land cheap obtained at RM 3.21 million or only RM 10 per square feet on the recommendation of the UMNO Deputy Chief Minister, the fact is the compensation to Nusmetro under compulsory acquisition by present Penang state Govt must reflect market value, which may far exceed the costs to Nusmetro at RM 3.21 million or only RM 10 per square feet.
An issue of Money here that LGE argues is “beyond the financial capability of the state government” what is the figure involved for a compulsory acquisition? Do we know it?
The main culprits are “Backdoor” Minister Koh Tsu Koon and his co-workers!
Kampung Buah Pala, sits on a 2.6ha prime land in the heart of the rapidly developing eastern part of George Town.
What’s it market worth ? RM50 million ???
Just because there are 300 villagers and their ancestors, mostly of Tamil origins, whose ancestors were said to have lived there for nearly 200 years, Hindraf’s P Uthayakumar describes it as ‘Tamil Hindu living cultural site’!
Can one just impose an obligation on the state govt to compulsorily acquire just because one brands it ‘Tamil Hindu living cultural site’ just to evoke communal sentiments??? So what happens if in another chinese village where villagers have first setled there 20 years ago MCA politicians (for votes) brand it ‘Chinese living cultural site’ and demand LGE to compulsorily acquire it? This puts LGE in an untenable position : don’t accede lose votes from a certain community, accede to it, bankrupt the state govt!
Uthayakumar suggested the Penang state government to secure a RM50 million federal grant to beautify and upgrade the village’s traditional features! He’s dreaming? What is the reasonable basis for him to think the BN Federal Govt will give RM50 million federal grant if LGE asks for it???
Oops – “another chinese village where villagers have first setyled there 200 years”
It is not easy to manage a State where the previous manager is downright crooked.
It is 10 times harder when the crook belongs to the crooked government.
I do not envy Lim Eng Guan so call rosy job…but that’s his destiny and he has to do…. his utmost best.
Yes buy cheap from the poor and sell it dear to….making millions..using tax payers money to pay and enrich few in UMNO and BN.
This is very common and legal too.
Bottom line…who benefited from such deals.
UMNO always ask for proof …this and that…to defense their crooked deals…with no shame at all …to cheat poor Malaysians.
I am surprised Hindraf have turn coat?
Did I read it wrong?
Lets see more signs and maybe the group in Penang are frogs..sold for money.
Brace yourselves for more surprises and unexpected events.
I wish LEG good health nd best of luck.
For sure…vast majority Penang folks understands his difficulties and are are solidly behind him.
When yu are totally honest…no one can shake you.
Few mistakes are expected…..with no corruptions involved. He is after all..human.
halo DAP friends,
This is not a racial issue, this is a LAND issue!
The demands from the kampung people are very clear:
1. Menarik balik hak milik tanah Kampung Buah Pala daripada pihak pemaju.
2. Menggunakan Akta Pengambilan Tanah untuk mengambil balik tanah Kampung Buah Bala daripada pihak pemaju (sekiranya no. 1 tidak dilaksanakan)
3. Memasukkan kaveat ke atas tanah Kampung Buah Pala untuk menghalang pemaju daripada masuk ke tanah tersebut.
4. Mewartakan tanah Kampung Buah Pala sebagai tanah warisan budaya.
So, what the DAP state government need to do now is practice your power as a state government.
Eviction is the day after, people are losing their house. So, act now, stop talk cocks!
Kepada Kerajaan Pakatan Pulau Pinang,
SELAMATKAN KAMPUNG BUAH PALA DEMI SELAMATKAN KEPERCAYAAN RAKYAT TERHADAP KERAJAAN PULAU PINANG
Kampung Buah Pala, yang merupakan kampung tradisional yang terakhir di Pulau Pinang, sedang menghadapi ancaman pengusiran oleh pemaju pada 2 Julai 2009. Pencerobohan dan pengusiran oleh pihak pemaju akan menyebabkan lebih daripada 65 keluarga di Kampung Buah Pala kehilangan tempat kediaman, dan seterusnya menghancurkan sebuah kampung tradisional yang merupakan warisan budaya yang tidak ternilai!
Masalah penduduk-penduduk Kampung Buah Pala adalah berpunca daripada amalan kerajaan Barisan Nasional yang anti-rakyat dan mementingkan keuntungan segelintir kroni. Kerajaan Pakatan Negeri Pulau Pinang yang menyifatkan sendiri sebagai kerajaan rakyat mesti mengambil tindakan segera untuk menghalang pengusiran daripada berlaku.
Saya, Teh Chun Hong sangat mengambil berat terhadap perkara ini dan mengesa kerajaan negeri untuk mengambil tindakan berikut dengan kadar segera:
1. Menarik balik hak milik tanah Kampung Buah Pala daripada pihak pemaju.
2. Menggunakan Akta Pengambilan Tanah untuk mengambil balik tanah Kampung Buah Bala daripada pihak pemaju (sekiranya no. 1 tidak dilaksanakan)
3. Memasukkan kaveat ke atas tanah Kampung Buah Pala untuk menghalang pemaju daripada masuk ke tanah tersebut.
4. Mewartakan tanah Kampung Buah Pala sebagai tanah warisan budaya.
Semua tindakan di atas perlu dilakukan dengan segera supaya kampong halaman saya/kami tidak dihancurkan oleh pihak pemaju yang tamakkan keuntungan diri sendiri.
Saya/Kami berharap kerajaan Pakatan Rakyat Negeri Pulau Pinang dapat bertindak secara BERANI dalam membela nasib rakyat biasa dan menghalang syarikat kroni berkepentingan sendiri daripada terus mencabuli hak rakyat.
Selamatkan Kampung Buah Pala bukan sahaja untuk selamatkan ramah halaman rakyat biasa dan warisan budaya Pulau Pinang, malah juga untuk selamatkan kewibawaan Kerajaan Pakatan Rakyat Negeri Pulau Pinang serta kepercayaan rakyat ke atasnya!
Sekian.
Teh Chun Hong
HINDRAF claimed PR gave lands to Malay and Chinese. Yes, that’s true, but those lands are belonged to the state government, therefore PR does not need to pay compensation. However, in the Kampung Buah Pala case, PR might end up paying many times higher than RM3.21 millions to acquire the land from the developer. You should know who are behind the developer. Unfortunately, Penang PR state government is not very rich at the moment. I can’t remember where I read the news Uthayakumar suggested Penang government to give another land to the developer for exchanging with Kampung Buah Pala. But I don’t it’s easy because if UMNO/BN are behind the developer, do you think the developer really cares about the new land? This is the best chance to weaken the PR government. If they are succeed and UMNO/BN takes over the state government in next general election, the UMNO/BN developers will definitely earn 100 times than the RM3.21. Therefore, Uthayakumar should urge the Hindraf supporters to be patient, while tries to drag the court case beyond 13th general election. Then give full support to PR in the 13th general election. If PR takes the federal government, then Uthayakumar, Hindraf and particularly Indian community, can have their hope become true because at that time, PR can have access to huge public fund. Think about it… Uthayakumar…
I see Hindraf veering more to BN now than PR. The reason is quite simple. Fundamentally, Hindraf was never a good match for the multi-racial ideology of PR. It’s like a square peg in a round hole.
PR wants to help all races equally based on need but Hindraf demands that Indians must be specially helped. Hence to Hindraf, PR will never be able to do enough for Indians.
Hindraf’s ethno-centric attitude of each race fighting for itself is a good fit to the BN system of race-based politics. Hence Hindraf will veer towards BN who will hold them with promises and help to propagate a system which has marginalized Indians.
Another Samy Vellu will arise under another political party!
Most of them are hot headed with cow brains.
Sensitive and jump to wrong conclusions will be their weakest point.
Brave as they are…yet so stupid and impatient.to confront LEG.
That’s where UMNO will laugh at them…if they do not calm down and think twice…. before speaking.
I walked with them. Had 2 tear gas and water treatments. Never regretted…for I walked for the poorest of the poor…uncared by the government or MIC…..but this disappoint me greatly.
We hope that the Hindraf leaders will not sell their souls to BeEnd. Have they ever do some researches into this issue? Why aims the gun at YAB LGE and company, when this mess was created by the backdoor listed minister and company in 2007? The Hindraf leaders should go after the backdoor listed minister instead of getting the wrong person (YAB LGE). We urge the Hindraf leaders to stay cool and think properly over this issue over and over again.
monsterball:
It’s Lim Guan Eng, or LGE lah !!
Hindraf should go after the previous Koh Tsu Koon govt..and not the present one led by LGE.. Hindraf must understand tat the state govt cannot go against the court order. If they want to demonstrate, then go to Putrajaya and look for Ah Koon!
It is time the DAP grab Koh TK’s buah palaand take him to court over the sale of the kampung in 2007.
Yeap Hindraf,what you doing to LGE now,is it a kind of secret trade off with Umno/NR to release your guys under ISA ?. Come on you smart guys,don’t be cowed by NR ! Use your conscience and don’t let Umno /NR use you to destroy PR and PR’s penang state government and other state governments control by PR. You guys fought so hard together with DAP and PKR,even being arrested under ISA and detained.Together you guys won five state governments,though recently lost one to BN (Perak).It’s a great achievement,please be proud to hold on to it and don’t let it slips out of your hands just because of a petty issue.Please be patient and reasonable and in a matter of some time it will pay well for all you guys.
I thought LGE did quite a good job in explaining the real situation the State Government is facing to appeal to the understanding of the people affected. If that is not good enough, the State or NGO should start a Forum to discuss the issues and share thoughts to overcome the PROBLEMS CREATED BY THE PREVIOUS GOVERNMENT. Knowing UMNO/BN, they are prowling around looking for chances to tear PR apart. LGE has to be very careful not to played into their hands. Lest it is like Perak!!
High Chaparral? Nein, Nyet, Nope
It’s Gunfight at the O.K. Corral!
The main culprit is busy with KPI
while others are busy barking up the wrong tree
According to TheMalasiaInsider’s 30th June Report:
· Hindraf) is organising a nationwide protest against DAP-led Penang government on Kampung Buah Pala issue;
· Protests will be held at DAP headquarters in Ipoh, Petaling Jaya and Seremban. They plan to burn an effigy of the DAP secretary-general. This is to show HINDRAF’s seriousness in fighting this issue.
They also stoke racial sentiments in saying : “If PR state governments can give land to Chinese and Malays, then why not Indians? If they cannot even solve this, then what is the different between Umno and DAP?” P. Uthayakumar asked.
He had called on Lim to use his powers as chief minister to save Kampung Buah Pala from developers as provided in Section 76 of the National Land Code (NLC), ie LGE could “with a stroke of the pen” provide/alienate a different plot of land to the developers(in exchange for the developer’s acquired Kampung Buah Pala land) should it (Penang state Govt) be unable to pay compensation to the developer.
It looks to me that HINDRAF /P. Uthayakumar are totally unreasonable here: What makes them think that developer will agree to or accept another alternative plot of land in lieu of prime land on which Kampung Buah Pala now sits (even if LGE could find an alternative plot and has power under section 76 of NLC to alienate it to the developer ???) by this coming Thursday (or threat nation wide protests)?
They are just twisting arm of LGE and applying street wise pressure and (basically) calling on/fomenting their constituency to repudiate the DAP/Penang State Govt . to the utter pleasure of your BN political rivals.
An unseen hand could be brewing problems (systematically) under a Master Plan – first in Perak State Assembly, then talks of Unity Govt, then Penang via Hindraf and maybe (later) PAS in Selangor and Kedah. There could be more than that which meets the eye.
What a “stroke of the pen?” Even if BN Penang state EXCO were to sit tomorrow to approve alienation of any land to any person, procedures of alienation (especially bureaucrats in land office/registries) can delay the process for years. If they in their fiefdom care not even if the PM pushes for it, you think they’d care for the CM of Penang? No developer will accept any other land in exchange until the alternative land is already about to be delivered to its hands. This could take years. Get real.
On the subject of money – wouldn’t it be possible, with a transparent and accountable government, to ascertain the availability of money for one’s self? LGE’s protestations of “it’s a lot of money you know?” are all well and good, but presumably LGE could just send Hindraf to the State Government’s accountant who could point out a couple of figures and shrug his shoulders.
I guess, even if it is RM100m, the State accounts might show that they could afford it, but it would obviously have a serious impact on everything else they wanted to accomplish. Everybody else’ concerns may not be of sufficient concern to dissuade them from pressing with their demands.
How about heading off this sort of problem in future with a State Heritage fund, with a budget, accepting proposals for funding on a strict lottery basis, with chances of winning inversely proportional to amount applied for? A bit heartless, perhaps, but absolutely incorruptible. An alternative would be to invite the public at regular intervals to vote for the proposals they would most like to win funding.
It’s too late to put something in place for this particular instance – the only solution for which is to continue doing what has been done previously: remind everyone that the events were set on course by a previous administration, continue working with them in the hopes that some mutually satisfactory outcome can be achieved – and allow them space to protest.
If Hindraf starts demos against the DAP, guess what the police would do?
A. Hand out free refreshments to the Hindraf demonstrators
B. Attack pro-DAP counter-demonstrators, as was done in Iran
C. Give Tunship to Uthayakumar
D. All of the above
this is the balance of shits left over by ktk lah. not only this issue, still got alot. this ktk like to userice to change potato with someone. Gerakan is another barbie doll for PM.
LGE, it is no surprise that you inherit your father’s style and approach….
– Blame others to hide own weaknesses
– Continuous attempt to make others responsible
– Exaggerate own political gimmics in effort to seek popularity
– Deny others’ right to please own people
– High respect for a tiny country
– etc
You are the legitimate Penang CM… You are responsible to solve the issue … don’t need to flashback …don’t just blame the previous administration. If you can’t solve the problem, you must tender your resignation ASAP… That’s the reason we hate nepotism…. if necessary, consult with CM Mentor before making the final decision…..Sometimes I wonder…Why don’t you create a special post called CM mentor which is equivalent to the Minister Mentor in your state lineup?? After all, you all have high regards for that little country….
cintanegara Says:
That’s the reason we hate nepotism– go tell that to Bijan, the son of Razak, and he’ll have you c4ed
Most Hindraf members were formerly MIC members. They had been marginalised by BN govt. for the last 52 years but their leaders didn’t do much for them and yet they didn’t make that much noise.
Now that things are just beginning to get better in PR controlled states despite the mountain-load of problems inherited from the corrupt former BN Administations, it seems odd that Hindraf leaders are acting in manners that are not very helpful to the PR coalition.
Are the Hindraf leaders blind because they have eyes that cannot see? Have they been ‘bought over’ by UMNO BARU/BN. Whatever it is, I have this to say to Hindraf grassroot members : Your present leaders are undependable. Kick them out before they play you out. And please do not wait for another 52 years to act! You have a responsibility to your own community and all your Malaysian brothers and sisters to help PR take over the Federal government.
Under PR, things can only get better because the badness of UMNO Baru/BN is already at its pit.
hindraf should return to MIC if they keep want fight for rights of indian community only. PR is work for all malaysian but not for only malay, chinese or indian
This is so funny. Blame LGE, blame KSK … blame everyone! Hahahaha … the blame lies solely with the resident of High Chapparal. They DO NOT OWN THE LAND. Period!
KSK can sell the land for RM1 if he likes and he DOES NOT NEED TO CONSULT the SQUATTERS! He should be investigated for selling it cheap but that is another matter.
Squatters have no rights over the land and if they have any equitable rights it can easily be satisfied by payment or would have been satisfied especially those who conduct business over the land.
I know squatters in Penang, I have dealt with them, offer RM200K for a worthless house and they want RM400K. They are all unreasonable. They think they are worth so much when they are not. I have no sympathy for such squatters.
All I can say is bring in the bulldozers and time to remove them. Remember Thean Teik Estate? Same thing … all lost in the courts as the law is JUST in this instance.
Any of you who feel otherwise have never had squatters on your land. Get some and then you will sing another tune.
Godfather..It is Lim Guan Eng…writing about Lim Eng Guan’s territory…..hahahahahahaha
SpeakUp Says: Squatters have no rights over the land
Hey! I asked this question on Anil Netto’s site: is ‘Adverse Possession’ in Malaysian Law? In the UK a person using land as though they are the exclusive owner can become the registered owner of the land after so many years, even when the land is already registered to someone else. You might have heard of “possession is nine tenths” and “use it or lose it”.
I was a squatter once. Bought a house and didn’t realise that some of the land described in the sale wasn’t actually registered in the deeds. I had to be very busy tending to ‘my’ garden for ten years, until I could register it.
Any of you who feel that courts recognising adverse possession is wrong should experience the other side of the issue and then you will sing another tune.
YB,
please find some way to save the people of High Chapparal. A good friend of mine is staying there.
SOme of the ideas given by Teh Chun Hong above seems possible such as the state acquiring the land.
I think DAP in Penang should try to help out the local people. Don’t become like PAS in Kedah…….which always give excuses.
I believe DAP can help the High Chapparal people.
It’s very simple. If at the Hindraf demonstrations you don’t see the usual water cannons and FRU coming to hit people with their batons, then they have been infiltrated by BN scumbags.
there is just to many problem in pakatan rakyat states………i hope that pakatan rakyat can try their best to solve it. even some bn leaders are now trying to split pakatan rakyat. Pakatan rakyat need to stay strong!
Ketua Pemuda Gerakan ketinggalan zaman, kata MB Kedah
ALOR SETAR, Jun 25 — Menteri Besar Kedah, Datuk Seri Azizan Razak menyifatkan Ketua Pemuda Gerakan Kedah, Tan Keng Liang ketinggalan zaman apabila terus mengajak orang menyertai BN.
“Semua sekarang nak tinggalkan Umno dan BN untuk menyertai PAS dan Pakatan Rakyat. Tiba-tiba dia pula ajak masuk BN, pelik sungguh,” kata Azizan kepada media dalam satu majlis di Gurun hari ini.
Azizan mengulas gesaan Tan yang meminta DAP dan PKR menyertai BN bagi membentuk kerajaan baru di Kedah dengan meninggalkan PAS.
Ini kerana, kata Tan, kerajaan Kedah dibawah pimpinan PAS sekarang meminggirkan orang bukan Melayu di Kedah.
Menurut Azizan, Tan ketinggalan dalam banyak hal termasuk isu kouta 50 peratus untuk orang Melayu apabila tanah rezab Melayu diambil untuk projek perumahan di bandar Alor Setar.
Tan juga, kata Azizan, ketinggalan dalam isu pusat penyembelihan babi di Mergong.
Sebelum ini, Azizan berkata, yang tidak adil adalah kerajaan BN sebelum ini yang telah meluluskan tanah rezab Melayu untuk projek perumahan tetapi menetapkan hanya 20 peratus sahaja kouta untuk orang Melayu.
“Ini tanah rezab Melayu, bukan tanah pegangan bebas. Untuk tanah pegangan bebas, mana ada syarat itu,” katanya.
Dalam isu pusat penyembelihan babi di Mergong pula, pusat yang terletak di Pasar Mergong ini, walaupun telah bergerak selama lebih 30 tahun, namun ia tidak pernah mempunyai lesen yang sah dari pihak berkuasa tempatan.
Aktivitinya pula mendapat bantahan orang Melayu yang turut ke pasar ini kerana bahan-bahan buangannya dibuang dalam tong sampah yang sama dengan penggunaan lain dan sebahagiannya dialirkan ke sungai berdekatan.
Ekoran bantahan itu, Majlis Bandaraya Alor Setar telah mengarahkan pusat penyembelihan ini dipindahkan ke tempat lain.
Ekoran itu, persatuan peniaga babi ini telah membuat rayuan kepada Menteri Besar Kedah untuk memberikan tempoh kepada mereka sebulan untuk mendapatkan tempat baru.
“Menteri Besar telah menulis surat kepada Datuk Bandar Alor Setar agar rayuan mereka ini diterima. Jika selepas sebulan mereka tidak dapat kawasan baru, itu masalah mereka kerana mereka yang meminta tempoh sebulan,” kata Setiausaha Akhbar MB Kedah, Helmi Khalid yang dihubungi hari ini.
Menurut Helmi, satu kawasan baru telah dikenalpasti untuk dijadikan tempat penyembelihan babi ini iaitu di satu kawasan dalam Kampung Cina Pendang.
“Pejabat MB telah bersetuju dengan tapak baru ini jika mendapat kelulusan khasnya dari Jabatan Veterinar. Surat juga telah dihantar kepada Yang Dipertua Majlis Daerah Pendang agar permohonan ini diluluskan jika mendapat sokongan dari jabatan-jabatan berkaitan,” beritahu Helmi.
Sementara itu, hubungan antara parti-parti dalam Pakatan Rakyat di Kedah sangat baik, kata anggota Parlimen Jerai, Mohd Firdaus Jaafar.
“Oleh itu, saya yakin pancingan Tan itu tidak akan dimakan oleh sahabat-sahabat saya dalam PKR atau DAP. Orang sekarang nak tinggal BN dan nak masuk Pakatan,” kata beliau.
Tentang isu-isu yang dibangkitkan, Firdaus yakin ia akan adapat diselesaikan dengan baik Oleh MB Kedah.
“Sabarlah, isu babi ini sensitif dan tidak siapa mahu babi diternak atau disembelih di sebelah rumah mereka sekarang dengan wabak selsema babi ini. Jadi kena bersabarlah supaya kawasan yang dijadikan kawasan ternak dan sembelih itu nanti benar-benar sesuai,” katanya
This is OK rebuttal not great but OK only. Hindraf is being unreasonable but everyone suspect that. They are desperate movement and will do desperate things if unchecked. However, an inspired leadership would have been able to sent out something that made Hindraf shrinks back. LGE did not do that here.
Hindraf have made several wild points including claims that LGE can make it a historical site that would stop the project. The proposal are ridiculous. LGE should have made the rebuttal that while they understand Hindraf need to explore whatever possible, they must not do so too often and people will stop listening to them and then they would end up on the losing end themselves. Its fine to push the boundaries but overly imaginative ideas followed up by threats just makes everybody losers..
From malaysiakini:
He (Waytha Moorthy) slammed Lim for trying to “hoodwink the people” by citing finance as an excuse, just so he could shirk his responsibilities as chief minister, instead of using powers accorded to the chief minister by land laws.
He claimed that Lim can acquire the land for the public interest at a sum far below the market price.
Under Section 58 of the Land Acquisition Act, the state government is required to give reasonable compensation to the affected party or parties during any such exercise.
He also said the state government need not fear civil action by any developer because Section 68 of the same Act clearly states that ‘no party can bring any suit against government in regard to the compensated sum’.
——————–
Briefly, Waytha is saying LGE can acquire the land and strongarm the developer to accept below market price for the land.
How does this make the PR govt any better than BN?
Both Waytha and his brother are used to behaving like political gangsters. Why should LGE follow his method?
I agree with OrangRojak with his first comment. Chief Minister Lim Guan Eng should really watch his style. His way of conflict resolution and confronting everyone is not doing any good to his image nor his administration. I have always been of the opinion that he needs a PR firm or a spokesperson. Sadly, 15 months after gaining power, and 6 months after he said he would be less confronting, he is still very much his old self.
Squatters do have rights. However, they are sometimes led by lawyers in this country. Just ask around – I know of one who happens to be a state assemblymen asking the squatters to fight for their rights (in court) and in the meantime negotiate with the developer so that the case can be settled out of court. His asking price per squatter was in the vicinity of RM140,000 – half of that would go into his own pocket. Unfortunately the lawyers wished to be the first one to fight in court and win such cases, which would set a new precedent and add a lot more to his coffers – which is why such lawyers sometimes persuade and misled the squatters to ask more than they should or are entitled.
“Tamil Hindu living cultural site”. Really? Never been there but is it really true that it is a “Tamil Hindu living cultural site”? Or is it just a slum of illegal squatters on prime land?
As I understand it, the families living there have no rights to the land, it was state land. Now that it has been sold by the previous BN government for a song, the squatters want the new PR government to kow-tow to them to let them stay permanently, or else?
Why is this a HINDU issue? Is this a religious thing? Why is HINDRAF involved? Its a land issue plain and simple.
Is there any CULTURAL issue here? If so, get that Datuk Utama Wira Hero Rais Yatim, the Minister of Everything Culture, involved. He approved a few million ringgit for some old mansion in Penang to be restored because some Muslim jeweller stayed there briefly some decades ago so it has “historical and cultural value”, remember?
As I see it, it is a squatter issue with no “Tamil Hindu living cultural site” significance. The squatters just don’t want to leave, they consider the land theirs. They want to hold the government to ransom. They say the Tamils have been living in that village for some 200 years or so. So what?
There is a Kampong Siam in Kodiang Kedah where Thais have been living for 500 years. Another village in Tumpat has Thais who have been there for a similar period. And many, many more. Are we going to label all of them “living cultural villages”? Come on, get real. In some towns, there are no Bengallis in “Kampong Bengalli”.
It is sad that HINDRAF has gone blind to its objectives. It frequently raises religious issues when it should not. It has a chip against anything that affects an Indian and sees these in racial tones. It is sad. They have lost their way. They are hopelessly lost, their leaders even. They threaten, they expect you to kow-tow to them. The PR should just ignore these lost people and are better off without them. Let them fight alone their own battles.
Poor show HINDRAF. Extremely poor show.
We should do it the KL way … no building permission, tear it all down. Penang State Council in the past will never get involved. That is a big mistake.
Hindraf always impulsive first you made yourself famous by making ethnic cleansing accusations and now throwing tantrums with Penang gov on this issue. Why dont you just think rational and guard your principle of fairness or does it mean you are not bothered a bout? Yu bring disgrace to your people image. Now everyone will avoid dealing with you.
Orang Rojak … before you start to tell stories please read what the leading National Land Code writer has to say … this is Professor Buang Salleh:
http://hba.org.my/articles/salleh_buang/2002/primer.htm
His book is what all law students refer to when studying. So please … do not tell nonsense here. We also do not have a 10 year rule under the Limitations Act, its usually 6 or 12 and sometimes 3. Section 9 of the Limitations Act also states that it does apply to the NLC.
HINDRAF is not fair to LGE.
He has said that Ramasamy has tried his level best to help the villagers and some had accepted the compensation of RM200000.
The remainder want even more -to get the land back.
The right person to deal is that balless Koon. He agreed to the sale. Ask him to bail the villagers out.
To ask LGE to use state money to acquire the land is simply too much.
Penang is already short of fund and how can it afford.
The land is not cheap. At least RM25 million.
Koh Tsu Koon, be a man and come out of your hiding to save the villagers. It was your government that leaves trails of mesy deals
Malaysiakini reports Waytha used his 7 year old daughter to hand a memo to LGE.
Why is this guy always using young children to do his political deeds? This is in very bad taste. What is the relevance of using children here? It’s not about demolishing a kindergarden is it?
I nominate Waytha for the “Dirty Diapers Award” for using the innocence and appeal of young children for his political ends. And when is this coward going to come back instead of issuing statements like a big shot mafia from overseas?
I have said many times earlier, forget about HINDRAF. It is a group of loose cannons with racist and extremist tendency. Just because PR praised them before for their contributions, they think they are hell of great. Let them do what they like, trust me, HINDRAF is already a spent force. I am willing to bet with anybody here, including the master loose cannon ball.
LGE, I think it is time to get tough with all and sundries in Penang. There is no need to be a populist, just focus on governing effectively and fairly, which by way will inevitably kick the asses of some people, including the all powerful Penang hawkers. I think Penang will soon become the dirtiest town in Malaysia if nothing is done. It is time to keep Penang clean and orderly. Please don’t just talk and talk. Do it now.
HINDRAF started out well, now its all about Indian rights only that is UNREASONABLY demanded. What is their problem?
Thanks for that link SpeakUp, that was exactly what I wanted.
OrangRojak … no problem la … collectively working together the internet is a good thing. :)
HINDRAF is trying to flex its muscles and stay relevant. HINDRAF (much like UMNO/MCA/MIC) can only exist when other races/people can be made as bogeymen. Now that BN is weakened, HINDRAF is setting its sights on the PR government.
Because if a PR government can have a successful multi racial policies, the whole point of existence for HINDRAF ends. HINDRAF must ensure that only it alone can be made to appear as the saviors of the Indian race.
While i acknowledged the contribution of HINDRAF to the 2008 elections, i never supported their ethnically centric causes and was always wary that multi racial parties like PKR-DAP should get directly involved with them.
HINDRAF should be reminded that the Indian population has been stalwart supporters of BN for the past 20 years. I know many well educated Indian doctors and lawyers who were all staunch supporters of BN. They only switched sides in 2008 as a protest after the HINDRAF rally.
So i laugh at the irony of HINDRAF. After being marginalized by the government they were so loyal to for 20 years and doing ABSOLUTELY nothing, now they want to burn effigy’s of the CM of a new government that has only had 1 year in office.
LGE needs to build up some tact in making statements.
He needn’t have gone into racial stuff like tamil signboards and and indian DCM etc. That’s just playing the same game as BN. Offering little gestures here and there to soothe particular racial communities.
He should have just made a clear statement. This is not a racial issue. The state government has done everything it can and regrets that HINDRAF feels otherwise. HINDRAF is free to voice their displeasure as long as it is peaceful.
I personally do not support the Penang government being made to shell out millions to an UMNOputra company to save what is essentially a squatter village. If HINDRAF really wants to save the village, then i request that HINDRAF work with the state government to raise the needed funds through donations to purchase back the land.
The Penang government’s money is the property of all Penangites. The money does not belong to the HINDRAF to demand as they please. I challenge HINDRAF to hold a poll among Penangites to see if they support their government spending millions for such a purpose. I dare say the majority of Penangites would not agree.
OrangRojak,
For your information, Malaysia’s land law was modelled after Australia’s land law. British land law may not be applicable in Malaysia. Moreover, during Dr Mahthir’s tenure as the Prime Minister of Malaysia, many written laws had been passed in the parliament in order to put a stop on the excessive demand being always made by the squatters throughout most big cities in Malaysia.
The court orders, as mentioned by Lim Guan Eng here, which have been issued by the High Court and the Federal Court to the developer will give the developer the rights to evict any intruders or trespassers from the said land which is the subject matter of the court orders. The court of Malaysia also has power to order any state government to revise its offer price to the original landowner if the state government wishes to acquire a piece of land from a private owner, based on the principles of fairness and prevailing market price.
Lim Guan Eng is telling us the truth. As a Chief Minister of the State Government, he is also required to obey the rule of law!
Lim Guan Eng is now the Chief Minister who is given the power to act in accordance with the Penang State Constitution and the Federal Constitution of Malaysia. He should try to invite another affordable developer to come up with a joint-venture proposal with Penang State Government. If the proposal so made is deemed technically and financially feasible, then he shall proceed to invoke any state law for acquiring that piece of land and later on build a cultural village of commercial value there by offering the residential privilege to the current occupants of the land!
As for Hindraf, my advice is that Hindraf has to change its political strategy in order to enable it to penetrate into the hinterland of Indian Malaysians. I do not see that Hindraf is having much survival value for an extensive period of time if the Indian Community of Malaysia is to continue holding the viewpoint that Hindraf is like the MIC youth, which is needed SOMETIMES to serve as a pressure group of Indian interest, but eventually the votes will still be cast in favour of Samy Vellu because Samy Vellu can afford to buy votes!
Hindraf should not try to fool the Malaysian people by saying that a few squatter houses found in Kampung Buah Pala are having emotional value and historical value to Indian community of Penang therefore Lim Guan Eng is required to issue grant to the Indian residents there. The issue had already been complicated by the defeated Barisan Nasional State Government and it may take more than 10 years to settle the issue. The only wise action from Hindraf is that Hindraf should encourage Indian Malaysians to cast their votes to Pakatan Rakyat in order to ensure a higher level of human living quality and integrity for the Indian Community in Malaysia.
“DAP and the Pakatan Rakyat government will not back down or be cowed by BN, UMNO or Hindraf who continues to look at problems from a narrow racial spectrum of Chinese, Indian of Malays.” (Lim Guan Eng)
I think there is a typo in the above sentence. The last words “of Malays” should be much readable if they are changed to “or Malays”.
Kudos LGE you stood by your principles. Whom to give if every group
start asking.
Waytha was freed from ISA with a bargain, MIC/BN goons had infiltrated. I want to ask you some questions Waytha, where was Hindraft during the recent demolition of the Indian settlement Kg.Pandan (K.Lumpur/S’gor)?? Kugan and other Indian cases with PDRM?
Why didn’t you stupid fellas hold demo and burn the effigy of Najis??
Waytha and Hidraft dun talk cock you are fighting for your personal $$ interest… pls go and get it from UMNO or Samy!!
Full Stop!
Orang Rojak:
I think you’re a naive bleeding-heart champion who thinks by mere reasoning everything will be fine. This is not the UK, you know where the government there is amenable to public concern; where they follow parliamentary etiquette and transparency. By the way how many years have you been living in this country: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, … years?
This is Bolehland, where the BN federal government is so heartless, will not listen and does not follow the law. You think since anyone who is the State government can just wave a magic wand and every problem can be solved? The Penang State government is not under the BN coalition but is its rival. If you have not seen how the federal government has been denying funds and using all the federal apparatus against the Pakatan, you must be a real bloody nincompoop. Sorry for my strong language. The federal government under the BN is still obscenely powerful and if the Penang state government is not careful, it would be its undoing. Just witness how Karpal Singh’s impatient outburst against the Perak sultan give ammunition to the BN to attack the Pakatan coalition?
He’s not his dad is he? LGE always strikes me as having a slight but recurring problem with foot-in-mouth disease. -Orang Rojak
Chief Minister Lim Guan Eng should really watch his style. His way of conflict resolution and confronting everyone is not doing any good to his image nor his administration. I have always been of the opinion that he needs a PR firm or a spokesperson. Sadly, 15 months after gaining power, and 6 months after he said he would be less confronting, he is still very much his old self. – khensthoth
LGE needs to build up some tact in making statements. He needn’t have gone into racial stuff like tamil signboards and and indian DCM etc. That’s just playing the same game as BN. Offering little gestures here and there to soothe particular racial communities. – Katdog
I did not find anything wrong with what LGE said. From what I see, there are only two reasons why your comments seem to weigh on the side of criticism towards LGE, firstly, you guys are being over sensitive, secondly, you guys don’t really understand the situation.
Any difference between Umno n Hindraf?
Both are compatibly racist parties
Hindraf should replace MIC
and work as a subjugated party of Umno
What about the Tamils and Sikhs?
Why is Hindraf not demonstrating against UMNO or Gerakan or MCA or even MIC who are the main culprits and perpetrators behind Kampung Buah Pala? This begs the question whether Hindraf has now been infiltrated by collaborators of MIC and BN when it should be demonstrating against those who demolish temples and not the Penang state government seeking a fair deal for the Kampung Buah Pala villagers. – LGE
This is not about making new friends.
Lim Guan Eng is now the Chief Minister who is given the power to act in accordance with the Penang State Constitution and the Federal Constitution of Malaysia. He should try to invite another affordable developer to come up with a joint-venture proposal with Penang State Government. If the proposal so made is deemed technically and financially feasible, then he shall proceed to invoke any state law for acquiring that piece of land and later on build a cultural village of commercial value there by offering the residential privilege to the current occupants of the land! – Onlooker Politics
It is a NO! You can’t do things like that. Beside the owner of the land now, no other developer will dare to touch that land anyway.
On question of whther Squatters have rights, to the law students that SpeakUp talk about, the answer is mostly no and ever occasionally could be a “yes”.
Mostly no – because our Land Code based on Australian Torren System, and governing all lands for which individual titles subsist, does not recognise English concept of Adverse Possession (a 12 yr benchmark) that OrangRojak raised.
Occasionally no : Now clear at all that our Land Code provisions override equitable considerations – Lord Dennings estoppel principles (based on reliance on benefit/detriment) that NH Chan once referred to.
SpeakUp, you apparently read law – this equity principle based on English case of Inwards Bakers was raised – relied upon- in 1980 by Ulu Temiang (Seremban) 7 squatters when they, represented by DAP Seremban lawyers, brought action against Negri Sembilan State Govt for alienating land (earlier promised to them in writing by District officers) to KL’s developer Lesco. Federal Court (Eusoffe) circumvented this point. Did not rule Equity not applicable just because Land code provisions. Merely said Equity was of no application in cases involving overriding Public Interest. Something the Federal Court even then slanted in favour of Govt when it seemed to say that alienation to who and who and who was State Authority’s prerogative based on what it deemed public interest. (Of course we now know better that what is public interest is often private interest).
typo…”NOT clear at all that” in 3rd para…
No one knows who’s a squatter to whom compensation is given. Is it the guy who expended money & built a shack tenanted out or the tenant himself? Sometimes 1 family occupies 2 adjoining shacks and ask for compensation twice. Then they are instigated by outsiders having political (HINDRAF) or private agendas who finance their lawyers to commence legal action.. Never mind the law says squatters have no land rights. They still bring a legal action on some arguable point based on equity or some other flimsy reasons. Why do they case, somebody else pay for their lawyers. The idea is not to win the court case. There’s no assurance they can ever win. The strategy is to delay by court action, this procedural objection and that objection, injunction, appeal after appeal until a good 5 or 10 years are passed. Developers on prime land cannot afford this for 2 reasons: (1) interest holding costs when loan raised to acquire land or some parts of bridging loan used for “development costs” ie including bribes to this official or that official for approval of conversion building plans etc (2) Property has cycle esp in present time of economic recession world wide, our market artificially propped up by pushing cost of funds down and the cycle may just tuen against the developer.
Here’s where you could squeeze the developer : it has to pay the patrons and instigators and ring leaders of those who brought legal action against developer to discontinue their case. If not drag the developer for over 10 years in court and its projects cannot lift off, it may even lose profits if not capital outlay which sometimes come out to hundreds of millions.
So you tell the developer – brother you either lose RM 200 million in profit if my injunction and legal case drag on for 10 years OR you could still make your RM200 million by me withdrawing the case so that youy could launch your development scheme immediately before cycle turns – provided……..you pay me lah RM10 million.
Get the picture? I have seen it happened before.
However if developer pays me RM20 million even better, I’ll get Indonesian contract workers for it inspite of the Indonesia’ ban. I’ll even promote sales for it, buy a row of shophouses on launch price. If not, I may have (not judges) but lowly filing clerks in courts under my payroll who for RM2000 will loose the court file everytime hearing is scheduled and there has to be postponed again and again until the developer collapses in despair. I also have people in the land office/registry under payroll to delay the developer’s various applications necessary for development. Sure developer too has its people at these places. So one side will lose the file, the other retrieve it and everyone happy in this merry go round of corruption alive and kicking. I am not referring to any particular developer or situation here. I am referring generally to what could happen, has happened in other cases, and how squatters’ Cause is a wonderful leverage to facilitate all these because of its emotive appeal – that we must all fight for social and economic interests of the poor and the landless, and back door, capitalise on this opportumity to make money out of those who have ie. the developer who (win-win) is urged to pass the costs to purchaser…. :)
Hindraf is acting just like George W Bush. Instead of hunting down Al-Qaeda for the 9/11 attacks, he chose to invade a third country -Iraq- which has nothing to do with 9/11 (but has the world’s 3rd largest oil reserves). So Koh TK gets away with his juicy carrot but LGE gets the big stick.
On LGE comment that Hindraf should know who their friends and foe are: I would have rephrase it differently.
Hindraf is a radical movement and will friends and foe will get hurt in what they do. Friends of Hindraf will let them hurt them a but but there is a limit to it. In addition, Hindraf future is focussing on hurting their foes a lot more, much more, than carelessly hurting their friends.
Jeff … proprietary estoppel is not always what it is in squatter cases. Most come onto the land based on a mere arrangement. In Penang its usually because the land is idle so the landlord asks them to stay and keep it occupied. Other times its because its perhaps a coconut plantation and they landlord needs natural fertilisers so he let’s them occupy to breed pigs or chickens.
You are aware of the pure forms of proprietary estoppel, representation is made, acted upon etc etc … in squatter cases its not as such. Even if it were it was to the grandfather.
Yes, I read law and I dealt with many squatters in my time, I evicted them all. Dealing with them is nuts. Standard cases where they claim equitable estoppel is usually sorted out by paying them the value of the HOUSE itself. Usually, tens of thousands only. Even with an offer of RM100K they will ask for RM200K.
I cleared homes, temples and graveyards in my time. I always pushed for very fair compensation even when we can go for broke BUT they always push their luck and always have lost in the courts. They then end up with nothing then lament the developer is unfair.
Give you a good example. In Kulim Hitec Park we had a very small estate temple that did not want to move. The offer to move was RM400K and a piece of land nearby. Well, the so called temple committee wanted like RM700K. So we went for broke … they got nothing. Why? Simple … temples cannot claim estoppel because its an association, the NLC does not give rights to associations but only individuals and companies.
Hence, reading this I have no sympathy for the squatters. LGE is right … he has done all he can. Why should we spend RM20M just for some jokers who are financially underprivileged? If we want to be a socialist state then are we all willing to pay high taxes like in the other countries?
Talk is cheap, yeah, LGE just make a compulsory acquisition then pay it cheap cheap etc. Be in his shoes then try it.
Also Jeff … try delaying cases, it will not work. Cases are delayed usually because the lawyer is not ready and have not done their job. If the file is ‘lost’ for more than twice, trust me the Registrar will be in trouble with the lawyer. If that does not happen then the lawyer is at fault. Delay is not a viable option nowadays to stall people. But I guess you are just joking la … hahahahaahaaa
LGE is a man who does not wanna waste time saying nice things only. True he is brash but better that then being a hypocrite right? Sometimes he does stick his foot into his own mouth and don’t we all do that BUT at the end of the day LGE is someone who truly wants to make changes for the people of Penang. Unlike his father who just complains all day.
PR needs to look at itself again. PKR is up to nonsense with their boycotts and frogs and By Elections, PAS is up to nonsense with the unity talks and trying to fish one ADUN of BN …
DSAI is talking nonsense when he speaks about doing away with English, if not he is sitting quietly behind as the Tok Dalang, useless man!
Go read the MT comments about DSAI, you will see he was the evil one behind our education system. You think a leopard will change its spots?
Last night at the PJ rally only 4,000 turned up! Where are the hundreds of thousands? No more now la … people are fed up with PR nowadays. ITS A FACT.
SpeakUp: Thanks for sharing with us your observations on/experience with squatters today at 10: 04.32 .
The Ulu Temiang (Seremban) squatters, which brought suit against State govt for its alienation to developer Lesco based it on certain letters prior issued by district officers to each of them that they would eventually obtain titles on the state land on which they squatted. So the estoppel was raised though not sure whether one calls it equitable or peroprietary.
Om your second posting – “DSAI is talking nonsense when he speaks about doing away with English” – this is admittedly a matter of concern, he (seems) to be falling back on the race card, which to me suggests he could be real worried about the imminent Saiful case against him. Which may or may not (depending on view point) be one of motivations why a certain section in PAS may tend to veer towards Unity Talk with UMNO, thinking that it may be a surer way to power or sharing of power than present arrangements of relying on Pakatan Rakyat (held together and led by him) to reach that destination.
“I am referring generally to what could happen, has happened in other cases, and how squatters’ Cause is a wonderful leverage to facilitate all these because of its emotive appeal – that we must all fight for social and economic interests of the poor and the landless, and back door, capitalise on this opportumity to make money out of those who have ie. the developer who (win-win) is urged to pass the costs to purchaser….” (Jeffrey)
After reading Jeffrey’s analysis on the litigation situation and Land Office tug-of-war situation, it is crystal clear that the developer will not likely be able to reap an attractive profit margin if the Penang State Government refuses to cooperate with the developer for the case of Kampung Buah Pala.
If I were the developer, I would had much better picked up a phone and made a call to Lim Guan Eng offering the Penang State Government to buy back that piece of land located at Kampung Buah Pala at my cost price immediately in order to cut losses now before additional holding costs would be billed to me by all my creditors and loan borrowers. What help can the judiciary system offer me if I as a developer is working against the Penang State Government and against the public opinion? Even if I am to jack up the sale price of my properties which are to be built at project site of Kampung Buah Pala, I am afraid that the prospective property purchasers may shun buying from me, lest the Penang State Government may delay preparation of strata titles for ever and ever again until the purchasers will lose all opportunities to reap good profit from the property investment due to lack of strata titles.
Jeff … the Ulu Temiang case is spot on, they were told that they can obtain title to the land. That is so classic.
Best of all today we see cracks in the whole PR, its so so sad. Today its DAP Kedah, yesterday its PAS Youth who wants to go for some whatever they wanna call talks. Then you got HINDRAF who are making Indian movies. What comes tomorrow?
Why can’t something which has been handed to DAP/PKR/PAS on a silver platter be cherished and well capitalised? The have a nice rally last night to bash BN and then proudly announce what happened before only merely 4,000 people and now PR looks so so stupid.
Trust me Najib and BN are laughing tonight and planning how to make the cracks bigger. 1Malaysia is not cracking, its PR.
Why is this happening? Because we have clowns for politicians. No. 1 clown is DSAI, then not far behind are people like LKS, Kepala Pusing and a few more.
Tell me, can any of them ever earn the respect of the rakyat like what Nik Aziz has? LGE needs to learn to be more suave and work on his own PR but he has the calling to be a good politician unlike his dad, sorry to say.
Go read Malaysia Today, all those who were blindly supporting PR with hope are now dissenting. The dissent has grown … BN is laughing. I think the dream of a better tomorrow has burst.
Where is Malaysia’s hope? What will we leave for our children?
p.s. also please save it if you want to post that BN has screwed us over for over 50 years, that is lame and boring. PR made a promise, they have failed to deliver.
Talking about lawyers. This is what I have to say.
Many of them are good (but not in human sense) in exploitation. They care more for money than anything else, even their race. They will collaborate with anybody even evils that makes their days at your expense. This is how most of them live.
Lee HS … sad to say but you are correct about most of them. Sad … suppose to champion for the people’s right (with a fee of course) but they will abuse the system. Cases are usually delayed because of the lawyer and then they tell the clients its the court and all sorts of nonsense.
I have friends who are court interpreters and they tell me this … after a case the litigant who is ignorant about law will ask them “Is it true the judge was paid off?”. The lawyer tells this to the client. This is sad …