( From Australian Broadcasting Corporation transcript of the Protes rally at the Kelana Jaya Stadium on Sunday. Clive Kessler is professor sociology at the University of New South Wales and one of Australia’s foremost Malaysia watchers.)
Clive Kessler: The situation in Malaysia at the moment is remarkable and that the brave hopes of independence have turned into an unbelievably sordid soap opera and the popular feeling among many people on the streets is precisely that. That in the sense they find the politics unbelievable, damaging and destructive and they see that more clearly than many of the political principles themselves.
Edmond Roy: He’s got a point. Consider this: the Opposition leader of the country is accused of sodomy.
The country’s Deputy Prime Minister is accused of conspiring to quash a murder investigation involving his private secretary and two of his bodyguards.
And last week, the Deputy Prime Minister Najib Razak was accused of having sex with the murder victim, Mongolian translator Altantuya Sharribuu, whose body was blown up with weapons-grade explosives in a forest outside the capital.
Clive Kessler argues this political quagmire has its roots in the past.
Clive Kessler: In a sense, that Dr Mahathir’s legacy was to create a very strong personalistic corporate state that was held together by his strength. Now that he’s gone, there isn’t his strength to hold it together. And the longer-term cost of the… creating that kind of state has to be paid, the bills are falling due and it’s a question whether, whether that is sustainable.
Edmond Roy: If recent events are any guide, it is clearly not sustainable.
Since independence from Britain in 1957, Umno, the ruling party has been steadily losing support.
This despite such innovations as the Bumiputera or “sons of the soil” policy that enabled the majority Malays to take a strangle hold on the political and economic life of the country.
Today minority groups have successfully challenged the status quo and in March this year, three main opposition parties won a record number of seats and control of five states in the union.
But all of this doesn’t necessarily mean that Malaysia’s democratic institutions are safe from attack.
Clive Kessler: The likelihood of a coalition misunderstanding becoming a political understanding and political crisis becoming a public, public order crisis seems to be fairly high. And it’s in that context that the police and army came out last week publicly to say well they’ve already got the contingency plans in place and they’re doing the dry run, more or less, to have a polite authoritarian solution to the politicians and the chaos they’ve created. I think that is the prospect that seems to me to be in the offing, rather than continuing democratisation.
Abdullah said he is going to end the soap opera.
How? I think he is not going to step down.
The solution is to fire his deputy prime minister, attornet general and inspector general of police. Ask them to go and makan angin.
I don’t see any other better solution to convince the people.
It would be better for the PM to relieve DPM of his duties and remove the military power from him – to sort out his personal matters instead of dragging all the rakyat through all these.
Sometimes it is easier to see the truth when you are not part of the action or have any vested interests …
Therefore, instead of rejecting criticisms from external parties like foreign observers or responding harshly to them, we should reflect on ourselves why the world perceives us as so.
Only the guilty and cowardly would be afraid of criticisms and changes.
And only the ignorant and foolish dare to brush them aside.
And only the indoctrinated and brainwashed would take up arms simply because the world thinks otherwise …
Let us not be part of any of these groups …
The diehard supporters of Sleepy Head in the current UMNO line-up:
1. A senior minister who lost RM12 billion of the nation’s reserves on FX speculation.
2. A senior UMNO figure who is implicated in the Lingam-gate scandal, but who has filed for judicial review.
3. A senior UMNO figure who was caught bring cash in a suitcase into Australia, but who got away on a language technicality.
These are FACTS, but in Bolehland, integrity and transparency are not top of the list of attributes for governance. It is so shameful that we are the laughing stock of the world, but to the leadership of Bolehland, it’s perfectly OK to let the world laugh at us so long as they can continue to dip their hands into the national coffers.
The financial institution is in their hands (UMNOPUTRAS)
The ARMED FORCES ( army, navy, airforce and police) are in their hands.
The JUDICIARY (judges, AG etc.etc.etc) is in their hands.
What are we going to do about it ? We can only talk and talk and talk and blog blog blog …….and that is all we can do.
THE VICIOUS CYCLE WILL GO ON UNTIL SOMETHING EXPLOSIVE HAPPENS LIKE WHAT IS HAPPENING IN OUR NEIGHBOURING COUNTRY. THEY HAVE SOLID B**LLS.
…….AND SO THE MOVING FINGER WRITES AND HAVING WRIT MOVES ON AND ON AND ON AND ON…….
BROTHER KIT YOU HAVE COME THUSFAR……DO SOMETHING CONSTRUCTIVE AND WE ARE ALL BEHIND YOU….PLS DO NOT GET THE WRONG IMPRESSION……????
It is obviously that UMNO is loosing their support from the people and their members of party. the question follow is will they able to accept lost if the upcoming election does not secure them the government power? unlike the Opposition parties, BN government has been too long in the position and forgotten their responsibilities and used to lies and conspiracies.
“Clive Kessler argues this political quagmire has its roots in the past.”
Duh!
“But all of this doesn’t necessarily mean that Malaysia’s democratic institutions are safe from attack.”
I am quite sure this is not the case.
Furthermore to suggest PM relieve his DPMs duties will not happen in this ERA cos ” DUA KALI LIMA AND LIMA KALI DUA ” both are in the same predicament and both are equally DISHONEST. How can a POT CALL A KETTLE BLACK….and how can PM point a finger at his DPM when four other fingers are pointing back at him.
SUDAH TERUK LAH BROTHERS….DOOOMED TO KINGDOM COME…..
ONLY A MIRACLE FROM THE ALMIGHTY ALLAH THROUGH PRAYERS PERFORMED BY SOME OF OUR PIOUS CITIZENS MAY BE THE LAST CHANCE FOR OUR BEAUTIFUL MALAYSIA TO BE RESTORED TO ITS FORMER GLORY….INSHA ALLAH
MAY THE ALMIGHTY ALLAH BLESS AND PROTECT MALAYSIA AND PURGE AND MAY HE DESTROY AND PUNISH ALL THOSE WHO HAVE BLATANTLY LIED AND SINNED AND THROW THEM INTO EARTHLY HELL……AMIN…
I think most people are quite stupid, passing the messages around through the cell phone. Is najib sure that no one can trace his messages to Razak about ‘be cool’?
Bala is located. I would not be surprised it was because he called his nephew. Some important persons must be under surveillance in this country. Don’t call or e-mail around because we are a police state (fortunately our police are not that smart yet)
Yes, the DPM should go for ‘cuti’ and not suitable to have military power at this moment.
A government that advocates racial supremacy is doomed to failure; no particular race would want to be sidelined or neglected in politics, economic development, education, public employment etc. The marginalized will eventually vent their anger and discontent on the government through the ballots.
I would accept a limited period of emergency rule if the PM needs it to fulfill all the promises he made the first time he won the elections; ie to reduce corruption and reform the police.
But emergency rule is not acceptable if it is just for the BN to remain in power. For example if MPs cross over, it simply means that the government must step down or call a snap elections.
http://malaysiawatch3.blogspot.com/2008/07/when-going-gets-tough-tough-must-get.html
Kessler has a very good point. It’s the failure of TDM that our democratic institutions have weakened to a state that they are functionally inept.
Checks and balances are the essence of any democracy. Respect for its institutions will ensure strength.
The government, as an entity, must be institutionalised.
This way the entity can continue on no matter who sits inside.
It must never be seemed as being controlled by a personality.
Mahathir did the second.
And they are now in great trouble.
When we have trouble, the answer must be to make amends.
When there are no efforts or genuine efforts to make amends then change.
What else it there.
Our laws allow change of government.
The Election law is clear on this.
It is a vicious cycle that Malaysia is going through now. Just look at other countries (Philippines, Indonesia), that were ruled by dictactors before and you will see the similar trend i.e. people are fed-up with the dictactor and they will overthrow the dictactor by force or by votes etc, once the dictactor left the scene, the power vacuum generated will suck in all the good and bad politicians etc. The political turbulence will be unsettled and will take time for the new govt to exercise its power to restore laws and orders etc. before the next cycle where the same govt maybe or to become corrupted etc. , unless there’s a perfect mechanism to regulate itself!!! As there’s no perfect person or system on earth except God, so the cycle whether short or long will repeat itself!!!
The Deputy PM should GO. Too many things linked to him has happened behind the Prime Minister’s back and the PM can not afford to come to his rescue anymore. It’s obvious, there’s ‘no smoke without fire’ – his body guards – UTK guys, his buddy and political analyst Razak Baginda, Private Investigator for RZ, Balasubramaniam’s SD1 then SD2 and now gone ‘MIA’.
Also pix of Saiful Bukhari’s pix taken at the DPM office with Najib’s personal assistant, Saiful’s night visits to DPM official residence – to seek his help in scholarship? To see his advice on how to tackle Anwar Ibrahim?
All these mischief if not linked to DPM Najib Tun Abdul Razak, then who is? Is he not a “suspect” then who is?
DPM must be immediately suspended from all official duties pending investigation from police and ACA!
Oops 2nd para: “seek”
The only thing i can think of, to say is this “Quis custodiet ipsos custodes” which means who guards the guards?
The democratic system allows the change of govt legally when the govt failed to perform to the satisfaction of the people i.e. by votes or other legal means!!! But some power crazy or corrupted govt will want to continue to hold on to power by all means, so they will use the military to achieve this goal i.e. emergency rule. Once this is established, it is very difficult if not impossible to go back to civilian rule, there are many e.g. on this as well. Emergency rule should be ruled out as one of the measures to solve non-critical issue, unless the objective is to gain power to rule without legitimate support from the people or to solve very critical issue which concerning national security e.g. the sacking or removal of the top general or defence minister who may want to overthrow the elected govt because of personal interest or crime etc. being investigated and prosecuted!!! Are we there yet???
C4 can easily get in malaysia.
In boleh where we have only the kangaroo courts, we need the religious court who will not be biased. I afraid the Chinese and non-muslims have to see that Islam, when practised properly, would be a much better religion than boleh democracy. May be Anwar now has to bring all BN liars, one by one, to the religious court.
Anwar lodges report with FT religious dept against Saiful
KUALA LUMPUR: PKR adviser Datuk Seri Anwar Ibrahim on Wednesday lodged a report with the Federal Territory religious department against Mohd Saiful Bukhari Azlan for falsely accusing him of fornication.
This was in response to Saiful’s police report, lodged on June 28, alleging Anwar had sodomised him at a condominium in Damansara.
Under Islamic Syariah Law, if Saiful fails to produce four witnesses to the alleged sodomy he can be found guilty and fined RM5,000 or jailed not more than three years, or both.
Malaysian have to understand that because of our lack of self-reliant, authoritharianism is very acceptable answer to chaos for most Malaysian. Consider what happened in 1969. The smartest people of the land was warning against NOT supporting the Alliance and MCA in particular but instead greed and self-interest resulted in decades of moving away from the ideals of the founding nation culiminating in Dr. M authoritarian regime that broke most of the strong institutions that we had.
Consider if oil hits US$250, and petrol at the pump without subsidies have to be RM6-7/liter. The lever of chaos would be back in the BN govt, they will take full advantage of it and the opposition would be helpless.
Reading some of the comments on this post, I have two things to say: (1) despite all the political turmoil that the country is in, the good consequence of it all is that Malaysians from all walks and quarters can generally discuss and debate intelligently without getting emotionally worked up. Intelligent online discussions and constant dialogue with the elected government will eventually lead to a peaceful solution, especially between BN and PR and the third force, the rakyat.
(2) We should focus on the issues involved rather than jump on quick solutions such as imposing temporary emergency rule or more absurdly, using Islamic courts to judge the parties involved. Religious issues should be tackled on their own merit and be completely separated from issues on race, politics or economics.
If oil hits the roof, there are too many potential scenarios for Msia which is too complicated to think about at this time. Deal with the today’s problems of inflation and accountability in public finances.
Restore rakyat’s confidence that the government is trustworthy and above partisan politics, then we can see some improvement in the current climate of mudslinging, soap opera and a full dose of bloggers’ jokes to amuse us for months.
I want to talk about Bung Mokhtar ‘gesture’ in Parliament. He has supposedly said he did not do it but outside of Parliament. There is no rule that says he can’t be rude but I think there are rules about lying.
The opposition should challenge Bung Mokhtar to repeat that he did not make a rude gesture which should then require the Speaker to censure him for lying.
Under sharia laws, which run in parallel to the secular courts in predominantly Muslim Malaysia, Saiful will be required to produce four credible witnesses to back up his claims, lawyers said. If he fails to do so, he can be declared a “fasid” or unreliable person, and faces three years imprisonment for bearing false witness.
http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/afp_asiapacific/view/359228/1/.html
(Bigjoe Says:
Today at 15: 05.25 (1 hour ago)
“I want to talk about Bung Mokhtar ‘gesture’ in Parliament…”
***************************************
Bung Mokhtar, Pahang Menteri Besar, they seem to be from the same breed or species efficiently capable of doing the ‘gestures’ on cue.
Very interesting to note how foreigners look at the situation in this country and how they perceived us, and in the end they will decide the foreign investment and the tourist arrivals in this country.
It is all negative and satirical about the leaders and the politics in this country. What a pity!
Who have created such impressions on outsiders? We ourselves and blame no one.
When we will ever develop maturity in our global outlook? Myopic and sad that we are forever stuck in the ketuanan melayu mindset, it looks like these leaders will forever be trapped in that cocoon.
The tunnel vision that ensued will bring them and the country to nowhere except ‘running on the spot’.
Kathy Says:
Today at 09: 50.54 (8 hours ago)
It would be better for the PM to relieve DPM of his duties and remove the military power from him…”
..and have a nincompoop take over??
Since when has military power of a country under civilian rule and civilian leadership since its independence, resided in the person of the deputy to the head of the executive branch? Is he a soldier in mufti, an army general who has personal command of troop divisions loyal to him? This guy isn’t trained to give even a proper military salute or stand at ease or hold a rifle in his life. He has been busy chasing skirts to want to hold anything like a rifle.
“Remove military power’ from him?? Don’t make us laugh!
Since when has the country’s armed forces, subservient to a civilian leadership since independence, been pledging their allegiance to a defence minister?
How do you remove something from a man, something he never has, never had and never will have – military power??
That is a nincompoop moment for you!
Saiful’s night visits to DPM official residence – to seek his help in scholarship? To see his advice on how to tackle Anwar Ibrahim?” Jong
It is to seek his wise counsel over a matter of a broken pipe and damage done as a result of poor plumbing work.
Our Defence Minister.
This guy said to have military power or control of it, isn’t trained to give even a proper military salute or stand at ease or hold a rifle in his life. He has been busy chasing skirts to want to hold anything like a rifle. Liking the feel of a pistol in his hand is not the same!
Undergrad2,
My piece was edited – I asked an ‘intelligent’ question, who else was there to meet at the DPM’s residence?
You are right, it’s a pity our armed forces have been reduced to pledging allegiance to a civilian minister who has not even hold a rifle in his life. They will obey to his whistle blows of course.
What a crying shame, after 51 yrs of independence, this is where we are?
Perhaps we should pause to take stock of what is really happening to this country.
Under Mahathir, it was a type of government political analysts describe as benevolent authoritarianism. It was stable politically until its deputy Prime Minister was arrested in 1998. But riddled by massive corruption over the years, it quickly deteriorates and is today on the fringe of becoming a country ruled by an Islamo fascist regime – against which the blowback we are seeing today speaks for itself.
What happened at the recent gathering meant to rally support of the rakyat against a government that has been ineffective in handling the country’s energy crisis, gives us a glimpse of the kind of mob rule which we as Malaysians are dangerously courting. Are we destined to ‘progress’ from a tyranny of the minority into what could be a tyranny of the majority – a kind of mob rule?? Is that what democracy is all about? Or is it an inevitable stage of transition that the country would have to pass through to get back to a kind of benevolent authoritarianism minus the corruption and the abuse of power? Or are we experimenting with the unknown?
Whatever that may be, capital flows from developed countries to developing countries have a history of minimizing risks to its beneficiaries by avoiding the vagaries of ‘change’.
Bad news for Malaysia! The sooner we solve this leadership crisis the better it will be for the country. It could be by way of a putsch or a calculated peaceful change, the kind one expects to see when enough of the people’s representative among our legislators cross over the aisle to transfer the mandate to rule a new group of legislators.
We should not view ‘change’ in terms of a “Bollywood style drama” of the Lingamgate variety.
Imagine you are the producer of this film which we are watching in reality now. Some of the starring casts have finished their roles. They are already out from the story. Now, there are still some who are acting out their roles. How will you write the story line ? Who has to go ? Who has to take over ? Who has to make the country stable ?
P.M. is from Pulau Pinang. He is not interested to develop his own state.
For those who were in Australia during the general election last Nov’07 will know the difference between the political maturity there & here. We may be political mature but bad political manure.
The opposition party, then lead by Kevin Rudd, won unanimously. No threats to the public of “what will happen should the opposition wins” & the new government went on to work immediately as they took office. No reports of missing files, protest after protest, rallies after rallies.
Life goes on for the nation & it is a benchmark of modern civilisation, politically as well. The new opposition, previously lead by John Howard, accepted the lost gracefully. Sadly, John Howard became a normal citizen the day after. No such thing as Tun John Howard – which means, he can be implicated under the Australian Laws – if he were to be found guilty of graft by the new administration.
In bolehland, the badge to do whatever you want & get away with it, is to have Tun titleship. This Tun-ship should be abolished. I don’t think it even exist in the UK. AAB knows he will get Tun-ship soon, so he will get away with murder. So will NR after he become PM. All these fiasco will be forgotten in another 10-20 years should BN remain in power.
Now we should know why that after over 50 years independence from British rule, we are still behaving the same way as 4th & 5th world African nation & why the developed world is laughing at us. We are way behind Thailand & Indonesia now. We were never close to Singapore, it was Brunei. We are getting closer to Vietnam, Myanmar & Cambodia. We are top 5 from the bottom.
pjboy,
Who says Tun-ship allows a recipient to get away with murder? No such thing, no one is above the law, not even the sultans. The reason why they dare not touch Mahathir-the-sifu is because they are as corrupted as him and they are afraid Mahathir may expose them and together they will sink. They are the same bunch of crooks!
Undergad2 says: “How do you remove something from a man, something he never has, never had and never will have – military power?? That is a nincompoop moment for you!”
Don’t be too sure mega nincompoop. The military may not be under the defence minister, but it is definitely under civilian government’s control. This is what and how our government should be and ought to be. To state otherwise like you is to give the military unwanted ambition. Please, you have enough of your moronic views. First you called for military intervention some days ago. Now you are saying military is not subservient to civilian government. Don’t be a mega nincompoop please.
undergrad2 says “Or is it an inevitable stage of transition that the country would have to pass through to get back to a kind of benevolent authoritarianism minus the corruption and the abuse of power?”
Please don’t make ideal statements here. Benevolent authoritarianism is extremely rare. The last time I checked was Singapore. Malaysia should go for open transparent democracy whatever its shortcomings. Please, no more guided democracy, benevolent authoritarianism, or whatever. These are all red herrings and big bullsh!t. Go for the best or not at all. We have got no more time to waste for another moronic Mahathir.
The police is under Badawi and Syed Hamid. The military is under Najib. If there is any message being sent from the police and military that the stable way forward is to let the country be run under a National Security Council, then it is not done out of goodness of the heart of the chief police or chief general but by Badawi and Najib, and that can only bode gravely for Malaysians – politicians preserving their position through force.
If one thinks that Mahathir practised benevolent authoritarianism, that fellow must have his head examined. Mahathir was and is a typical third world tribal leader – filled with inferiority complex, racism and bigotry. He neither has the right values nor the expertise to build a modern Malaysia. Please read “was Malaysia lucky or good in hands” in: limkamput-nincompoop.blogspot.com
Are you kidding me? The whole leadership of the BN gov should go. The PM and DPM is meant by that. They are not waking up to the tsunami that swept our nation. Not back in April and the re-wind of sodomy false accusation against DSAI is evidence enough that they will never wake up.
I wish for the day when these bloodsuckers wake up (literally, not morally, for by then who the h*ck cares) in jail over the crimes they committed against our people!
“Please read “was Malaysia lucky or good in hands” in: limkamput-nincompoop.blogspot.com” limkamput
What can be worse than the sight of a whore begging for customers?!
RIPLEYS CSI and many Malaysians were shocked to read another racist card been played by BN silly leaders on household income survey in Malaysia.
The strong “Authoritarian Solution” by BN leaders to find a better way to discriminate and marginalise other minority races when the household incoem survey is carried out based on inter-racial difference in income but choose the ignore the disparity of income among the riches and the hardcore poor people in Malaysia , Sabah and Sarawak today.
The inequality of household income in Malaysia has nothing to do with races but it is a comparison between the rich communities, medium communities and poor communities. Therefore, it is very wrong for BN Ministers and BN MPs to classify the household income based on inter-racial differences in the survey conducted recently.
Well, BN is well known as a “RACIST” party in the world. Their BN members and leaders were dirty brain washed for past 50 years to think one way ticket only and to hit on racist issue and like to play racist card to inflict conflicts among the rakyat.
Malaysians have “enough is enough” to listen, to be played out and to witness BN MP and BN ADUN were voicing out racist remarks again against another minority races in Parliament and Assembly. BN MPs are very proud about their Ketuanan subject to victimise another minority races branded like 3rd class citizen or migrants to Malaysia.
Yes, these BN MPs and ADUNs have 4th class mentality in their minds and dont want to accept new changes in the globalised world.
Now the world people are borderless regardless of races, creeds, religions and cultures are challenging at very stiff competitions to enhance the standard of living in their nations. The world leaders today are upgrading their people per-capital income as well as to enrich the value of their currencies today.
Sad to know that BN leaders have yet to learn their lessons and failed to wake up till today. They should knew their racist party had loss badly in the 12th GE becaususe of their greeds,corrupts, pride, abused power and arrogant mentality. Sad to say that BN leaders and their members still talk about ineaquality in inter-racial matter in term of economic and financial standings. Why dont BN leaders compared “SUPER RICH” Malays against majority medium and hardcore Malays- a comparison of apple vs apple? How can BN compared Chinese vs Malay ( like apple with orange)? Both races have different style of livings and budgeting their household income. Their mentality of earnings and spending their income are very much different.
For instance,
Chinese believed in working hard independently to earn more monies for a better living and develop good savings habits in their minds since childhood.
Malay believed in depending on “tongkat ali” from their Ketuanan leaders and pro-government to help them in loans, scholarships, contracts, employments and business assistances to earn more income for easy lifestyles and prefers to have lavish spending than savings in their mind since childhood.
Now majority Malays are educated and not easily deceived by BN leaders today. This is because many Malaysians regardless of race believed that BN leaders have failed badly in managing the wealth of the country. BN leaders should sit down and start listing their wrong doings for past 50 years and calculate the damages they have caused in the economy and financial well being in Malaysia.
A famous economist and a financial expert bravely said that our household income of RM1.00 earned in last year 2007 is almost equivalent to the purchasing power of RM0.30 in year 2008 because of great depreciation of ringgit currency against other forex currencies, huge prices hikes, huge inflation above 6% in half year 2008, devaluation of shares prices, stagflation in the economy, etc.
Lastly, Malaysians of all walks of life and regardless of races are becoming poorer each day and many corrupt politicians in BN are becoming richer laughing all the ways to the Banks.
Dont BN leaders felt ashamed to listen and see some Malaysians are selling their organs and blood soon to feed their families. Our BN leaders have failed the rakyat aspiration of Malaysia Boleh propaganda only.
We, Malaysians strongly opposed and against monitoring the inter-racial differences of income and it is irrelevant in Malaysia and should be removed from their BN crooked minds.
HIDUP RAKYAT MALAYSIA…cried a jobless Malaysian daddy of 6 kids and a sick wife.
(As I see, listen and read it. Write without FEAR and Favour, In GOD, We Trust )
by Ripleys CSI Malaysia today.
that was meant to entice you and you walked right into it, mega nincompoop. I can almost predict what you will do, beautiful.
BY the way, how does a whore beg for a customer? YOu care to describe based on your frequent experience?
Which one? The whore or the business?
The definition of a “whore” is he who comes to another blog and begs for readers of that blog to come to his blog so that he could stop talking to himself on his own blog. The nincompoop in him is when he uses ‘nincompoop’ as his handle to communicate with others and even naming his blog “nincompoop”.
any don’t sidestrack issues here. I have said you said stupid things. So if you can, just answer me those counter points i raised. otherwise just move on. a nincompoop is ok, but a mega nincompoop is of major concern.
A repost of what I wrote earlier on another thread:
“Our Armed Forces have been subservient to civilian authority ……”
And today I wrote:
“Since when has the country’s armed forces, subservient to a civilian leadership since independence, been pledging their allegiance to a defence minister?”
– – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –
Limkamput,
The nincompoop in you now says” …you called for military intervention some days ago. Now you are saying military is not subservient to civilian government.
My response:
The incongruity in what is written, and what is understood or not understood is too obvious to warrant further comment. Enough of the poop!
By the way, I would like to hear Kathy speak for ‘herself’ since my comments were directed at her!
It is true that since independence our country’s armed forces have been subservient to a civilian leadership; that that they have never pledged their allegiance to a defence minister. Not yet at least.
Omn neighbouring country, the Phillipines, for example, the civilian government of Ferdinand Marcos had been toppled by Lieut. General Fidel Ramos, Vice Chief of the armed forces, and Defense Minister Juan Ponce Enrile both throwing their support, and military support for Opposition Leader Corazon Aquino, the widow of slain former Senator Benigno Ninoy Aquino.
Only a nincompoop would claim that military power resides with the country’s Defense Minister – himself a civilian with no military training.
Kathy(?) Says:
Today at 09: 50.54 (8 hours ago)
“It would be better for the PM to relieve DPM of his duties and remove the military power from him…”
It is time to hear from “Kathy”….lol
If what is meant is that the defense portfolio be given to some other Minister, that would make sense.
Godfather said we lost RM12b in FX speculation.
I believe we also spent quite a bit in the London tin market;
in propping up BBMB for years
and in Hicom
and and in weapons we dont need
and in multimedia supercorridor (does this term ring any bell?)
and also in perwaja
and oh repairing parliament
and a certain elevated highway
oh there are so many of them.
just too many.
Let us not mention the sum involved.
We all will be in tears.
undergrad2,
You did call for military intervention some days ago. And you did imply military is not subservient to civilian government. On both counts you are mega nincompoop. You just can’t be honest with yourself. That is your personality. I also have no time for a mega nincompoop like yourself.
who is kathy?
In any open discussion like this it is healthier for the group if we try not to get personal.
I mean if “kathy” cannot answer maybe someone else has something to contribute?
“She” just did…..lol
A repost of what I wrote earlier on another thread:
“Our Armed Forces have been subservient to civilian authority ……”
And today I wrote:
“Since when has the country’s armed forces, subservient to a civilian leadership since independence, been pledging their allegiance to a defence minister?”
– – – — — — — — – – – – –
limkamput,
It is nobody’s fault that you cannot understand nor write English properly but your own.
you are bullsh!ting. i am just too lazy to go check your stupid postings. it is enough. you are the master chameleon. What is the point of you simply quoting out of context half sentence here and there. You said those things, period,. you are a mega nincompoop.
/// taiking Says:
Yesterday at 12: 09.12
The government, as an entity, must be institutionalised.
This way the entity can continue on no matter who sits inside.
It must never be seemed as being controlled by a personality.
Mahathir did the second.
And they are now in great trouble. ///
taiking – this is precisely why Malaysia is in so much trouble – the government has been institutionalized too much. To consolidate his powers, Mahathir instituted changes to the ways UMNO VPs are elected so much so that it is almost impossible now to dislodge the incumbent.
Yes, what you are seeing now is the entity (government) continuing no matter who sits inside (even if everyone is sleeping inside). It is on autopilot.
Better to have checks and balances…
I’m still waiting for good old ‘Kathy’ to respond to my comments – not his alter ego.
Here’s the quote you’re looking for – and it is coming from you!
limkamput Says:
June 30th, 2008 (2 weeks ago) at 09: 35.22
half baked american say: “Our Armed Forces have been subservient to civilian authority for far too long and should see their role more as keepers of that moral authority which BN has recently lost – the legitimacy and the moral authority to rule in a democracy dedicated to freedom, justice and the rule of law. The Malay Rulers must be involved in the process. Otherwise it is déjà vu all over again!”
So stop your nonsense and spare readers of all the poop you’re leaving behind.
Which part don’t you understand??
“There’s a reason you separate military and the police. One fights the enemies of the state, the other serves and protects the people. When the military becomes both, then the enemies of the state tend to become the people.”
US Armed Forces are under the control of the US President, via the control of the Secretary of Defense (who must be a civilian and not an active military military for 10(?) years). He controls the “Joint Chief of Staff” who controls the US Armed Forces. It is an appointment by the US President, hence, the US President is the head of the US Armed Forces.
Under any democratic elected government, the military serves the elected government of the day. However, we only have to look at Malaysia past where it was not too long ago where Malaysia have declared a State of Emergency where the Army along with the police enforced a curfew. Is Najib in charge of the MAF ? I would say the PM is and can call the MAF out to the streets of Malaysia with the blessing of the Agong.
I am sure LKS can correct me if I am have made an error as he would be the subject matter expert – as a MP and having live thru those troubled times.
///Dr Mahathir’s legacy was to create a very strong personalistic corporate state that was held together by his strength///- Clive Kessler.
That is true. However there is no point for strong authoritarian power to hold together a system of which corruption and abuse of power are rife. The alternative of things falling apart and centre does not hold is perhaps a not so palatable option that nevertheless is the painful enema to address this constipation of the system. The shit will hit the fan and let it fall where it falls. Is there a choice?
In meantime investors are clearing position in view of the political infighting, and Malaysians are suffering from double whammy from inflationary effects of petrol/feul hike as well as prices of foodstuff and other essentials…
For a long time the construction/property industry has been the prop – for ordinary people an edge against inflation, and income for banks, valuers, lawyers, engineers, surveyors, architects, construction workers and whole range of others with multiplier effects.
Now with inflation and diminuation of real income, the whole lot of people on property mortgages cannot service the loans and the prospect of NPLs and credit bust loom as a spectre. On the supply side developers wonder how they are going to dispose of their units. The govt tries to prop by getting banks to extend and prolong repayment terms (today’s news) to stall mass defaults….
Meanwhile the PM is enjoying a better position from deafult of the other two major contenders, one carrying theAltantuya Shaaribuu’s baggage of accusations and the other sodomy’s baggage of accusations .
According to Malaysiakini’s report based on Umno sources, AAB is widely expected to set a date for handing over the reins to Najib and the date flashed around seems to be June 2010.
If that is true, he is locked in safely as the other two slug it out and possibly mutually destructing by June 2010!
I think PR’s touted vote of no confidence is so far not real enough to ruffle him, so how the country navigates through such difficult times unfortunately will still depend on his stewardship.
PM’s greatest challenge is the economy.
We’re still blessed with gas, oil, palm oil, rubber and the price of these natural resources are going up! We have a reasonable middle & upper management echelons conversant in English, reasonable infrastructure not just in terms of roads, bridges, airports buildings and dams but also the intangible in terms of legal and corporate regulatory framework (as compared to competitor Thailand). China that pulls the crowd because of big market and cheap labour are feeling effects of labour costs going up as workers demand more wages from rising costs of living and world wide inflation.
The curse is of course leakages from largese and patronage political and corprate system.
The curse is not easy to rid within the system because many within the system are implicated in one way or another with either corrupt act, abuse of power or sexual misconduct, and each has a hold on the other so everyone has a cause to keep things staus quo to prolong ‘cari makan’ and postpone judgment day and accountability.
So because of that we cannot leverage effectively on our earlier said natural advantages and others’ woes. Not to mention the set back of vacumn of strong and credible political leadership should AAB fails to rejuvenate his style even if the two competitors are put out of action.
Where AAB fails, the other problem is can Pakatan rakyat take over and deliver a strong and credible leader who could secure power without taking Malaysians to street fightings and also keep PAS & DAP together if Anwar for any reason were brought down by the allegations?
This is where what Clive Kessler said – “the likelihood of a coalition misunderstanding becoming a political understanding and political crisis becoming a public, public order crisis seems to be fairly high” – is cryptic as well foreboding of something not so good is going to happen!
My sense is that PAS will make a bid, and if mainstream rejects, the BN under AAB will continue merrily on and it will still ultimately depend on AAB whether he could navigate between the pitfalls and reform the country for the collective better based on our inherent strengths and curbing the excesses in our patronage political culture.
Some recent statements made by Lee Kuan Yew:
“Malaysia is one of the wealthiest countries in the region.”
“But suddenly, it’s trapped in some political-cum-personal difficulties of charges and counter-charges which can only be bad for the economy.”
“But I see all these problems as man-made. It’s not economics. It is lack of a certain integrity in the system that you are entrusted with and you therefore run it properly.”
“People can say anything they like: Singapore is undemocratic, we trip our opposition down, this, that and the other. But if you say that this government is corrupt or has mismanaged the country’s resources, I’ll sue you!”
“But because we sue them again and again, nobody in Singapore believes that anybody is doing anything that’s criminal, corrupt or improper. So we can make a mistake — and everybody knows you can’t be 100 per cent right every time — but nobody has profited from that mistake.”
The method of propping up the economy with mega-projects for many years is now coming back to haunt us.
For many years many of the local grads were/are simply not good enough to be employed and many of our best talents have gone abroad.
These unemployables were absorbed by the civil service and that also makes us even more inefficient and very costly.
The years of abuse have weakened our human capital and very few business ventures have been created.
Yes the economy will be the turning point but it is the result of a system that has been damaged for too long by patronage and corruption.
Already beaten but too stubborn and arrogant to ship over.
A typical trait of a lousy loser.
Still sleeping and floating on clouds, assume rakyat stupid and education system had done a good job.
If they are so sincere about what they talk and advocate, why dont they turun padang and meet the grassroots 247 as long they still have the position.
Do a face to face with those who they called rakyat and not hide behind secretaries or skirts. Just continue telinga ringan and buta baca would do either.
Find out directly from the horses mouth.
See for yourself and feel for yourelf , nobody wants you and your cronies anymore, so get lost….the ….end.
“I think PR’s touted vote of no confidence is so far not real enough to ruffle him, so how the country navigates through such difficult times unfortunately will still depend on his stewardship.” Jeffrey
Why is Anwar Ibrahim stalling??
This is no time to look at issues affecting the future of this nation as “a series of Bollywood drama”.
quote: ONLY A MIRACLE FROM THE ALMIGHTY ALLAH THROUGH PRAYERS PERFORMED BY SOME OF OUR PIOUS CITIZENS MAY BE THE LAST CHANCE FOR OUR BEAUTIFUL MALAYSIA TO BE RESTORED TO ITS FORMER GLORY….INSHA ALLAH .. so said kritikus.
Rewind to the day Mahathir announced his intention to step down. The camera took a shot of his wife Siti Hashma, with her mouth agape, she was stunned. This meant that she did not know he intended to step down.
Then the camera panned to the senior members of the supreme council – they too were in shock. They too were not into the secret.
In other words the matter was never discussed at all.
This means that nobody was into the secret, that he would step down. I say he did not know it himself. It was a failure of his sanity at the most crucial moment – the entire nation was watching and he cannot retract!
In retrospect, Mahathir is a consummate political animal, and getting out of the arena just cannot be for him.
I suggest he blundered – he spoke in a moment of grandeur, to test the waters – what will the reaction be if he left them.
Then the realised his gravest political mistake and cleverly began to weep – he was ‘overcome with emotion.’ A good ploy not to say when will be the date of his departure.
He was led away to his private quarters, but UMNO people said, on his behalf that he would depart after the last Islamic meeting in KL.
Prior to his date of his departure, all were fearful that he might create trouble and declare martial rule , etc.
Racist & Abuse…
http://www.malaysiawaves.com/2008/07/umnos-latest-psy-war-materials-exposed.html
Why is Anwar Ibrahim stalling?
Maybe because he hasn’t been elected yet? And maybe because contesting in by-elections can be tricky business especially with the Head of the SPR nothing more than an UMNO dog?
How come our leaders are not nominated for the worse human model of the world?
we have the best of the best cheater, liar, hypocrite, corrupt, fraud, phony, pretender, and many others that is yet to be listed in the dictionary like the “Samy”, “C4”,
somebody should do something to give the proper title that they deserve.
DEar Katdog,
If SPR head is UMNO Dog( again the terminology used reflects attitude best termed as kurang ajar) , then please explain why PKR can form the govt in SElangor, as an exm.
Anwar is stalling simply because he does not have the numbers. Simple as that. No UMNO MPs want to join him as they know once they cross, there is no turning back.
THey will be regarded as a traitor. Politically, they will be finished. Despite poor result in last election, UMNO still has considerable influence among Malay community. If not, it would not have won 79 seats. Even in Anwar’s Permatang Pauh, one of the state seats, Seberang Jaya was won by UMNO .
Too many of the UMNO MPs are stuck deep in their own sh*t to be able to make their move. Even if they do try to, those stucked deeper in their own sh*t would not allow them!
Which part don’t you understand?? undergrad2 said.
i think you don’t understand what you yourself wrote. My advice, please write simple short sentences like me. Your english and faculty may not be as great as your ego thinks.
“Your english and faculty may not be as great as your ego thinks.” limkamput
So this is an admission that yours isn’t. OK. The next time I’ll write in simple English for you to understand. How many words do you want me to use in each sentence?
I must apologize for not giving equal opportunity to nincompoops.
I think I’ll have to do something to shorten my post made earlier just for you. What do you think?
undergrad2 Says:
Yesterday at 19: 03.45
Are you guys ready for some comic relief? Why not!
Here is the issue.
A claims he is the beneficiary of a kampong school education. He bashes people around for their postings. He can’t stand particularly a poster who says he is from Cambridge university, and uses derogatory terms to describe him. He takes to task a regular contributor to this blog for not knowing how to write. He says he is smarter and everybody else is stupid. He later tells us that he has been to the United States with his family studying before anybody else on this blog and others should take note To prove how knowledgeable he is than another poster, he insists that the United States was founded some 300 plus years ago – though it is a matter of public record that the year the U.S. came into being as a state and as a nation is 1776. He then insists that the U.S. Declaration of Independence is the same as the U.S. Constitution. He says to posters he could be their father and to take care what they post on this blog as he knows better since he has been round the block a few times. Upon returning to his country from the U.S., he served the corrupt BN government until, he tells us, he was decorated on retirement by the Agong with honors which he declares as “fairly respectable”.
Obviously he is uncomfortable in his own skin. No, that is not all. Finally he proudly tells us how he comes to use ‘limkamput’ as his handle. It derives, he says, from ‘nincompoop’ and sounds like it and he relishes in the fact that everybody has been deceived by him. He starts his own blog and later blasted the moderator for ‘not allowing him to advertise on this blog” here when others could.
What is wrong with this picture?
Undergrad2, let me show you how scr*wed up your English and thinking process are:
1. You don’t use “beneficiary” of a kampung school education. If kampong school connotes disadvantage, then it can’t be beneficiary. So beneficiary is a wrong choice of word. If you want me to give you a more appropriate word, please ask and I will revert to you.
2. There were no derogatory terms used (unlike you), but mostly intellectual discourse. Again, you are wrong.
3. It is not “that contributor” does not know how to write. It is he trying to be indulge in “hollow sophistication”. So you are wrong again.
4. I was in the US earlier than you, not anybody else. How many wrongs already?
5. With regard to the declaration of independence, the US constitution and the founding of US, I think I can understand where these are coming from. I realized I was talking with a half baked nincompoop whose mind is like a pre-school kid where everything must be stated in black and white. This person does not have the faculty to understand things in context. So you are not only wrong, but also stupid.
6. Yes the award is fairly respectable and I am fairly confident you will never get it in your life time. So please don’t be envious of things you do not have. It is one of the major sin.
7. There is nothing wrong with my skin. Is there anything wrong with yours?
8. Is there a problem with my blog? I challenge you to set up a blog of your own and write me thirty pieces in two months (for this is what I did and many of my pieces have also been published by a major newspaper with good reviews by fellow readers). If you can do that, I will keep my peace and never to argue with you again. But I know you are not good enough to do that. My blog again in case you tried to forget: limkamput-nincompoop.blogspot.com
some people like to pray, it their right
but other dont it is their rigth too.
Some insist others must pray .. other thinks otherwise becos it is not neccessary beocs it has been documented that all has been planned.
It is referred as fate.
So when that farmer got his cart stuck deep into the mud, laden full with his hard toil and have dark clouds of a storm fiercely announcing its presence…what could that farmer do…..his good may not reach the market or he may be struck by lightning.
“Splash” he throw his whip on his donkey back…hee hok came the reply and not a step move.
AHHHHH , wait the priest taught me to pray…he pray alright..till darkness came….the dark cloud are over his top…..
He could bear no more , if he cannot get his produce to the market , it would perish and with no takings his family would have worked longer to pay their land lords.
HEY YOU DREAMING DUMMY , came a voice from nowhere “why dont you get down and push your damn cart out of the way.”
He has just cause a traffic jam, and others are yelling and cursing him, so he got down and push the cart got rid from the mud and he was SAVE.
Luckily he pray , and he thnak his faith in the god he was praying too…….you and me.
So those of you still sleeping , just get down and DIY.
It is the best way…
With all the drama and political move, we the rakyat is so so sick!
First the the defections… now DSAI is talking about unrest will bring down the BN government.
Since DSAI mentioned Sept 16 for the cross over. So the unrest to bring down the BN government should be before 16 sept?
http://shiokguy.blogspot.com/2008/07/defections-vs-unrest.html
If after? what does it mean for DSAI?
Shiok Guy
its just insane, for all of u losers to call the EC a dog of the government when u won such a big seats…..dont u tink that Pak Lah will asked them to make it a BN instead of DAP/PAS/PR…………tink again….
i guest, u all the one that tarnished the stability of the nation and well done u love people (stupid australian) to talk bout yor country, as they themselves let the australian native to stay poor n stupid…………I guest, that what Uncle Kit try to do hHUHHHHH???