The government’s about-turn to renew the publishing permit of Tamil daily Makkal Osai which it banned last week is welcome as it would have otherwise destroyed the credibility of all reform pledges of Prime Minister, Datuk Seri Abdullah Ahmad Badawi on the judiciary and the anti-corruption agency.
The Home Minister, Datuk Seri Hamid Albar should learn the lesson of the Makkal Osai faux pax and not repeat the same mistake of complying obediently and blindly the dictates of the “Little Napoleons” in the bureaucracy and to bring to bear his higher duties and responsibilities as the Minister ultimately responsible for all decisions made by his ministry.
Now, it is for Hamid to order the immediate and unconditional release of the Hindraf 5 from Internal Security Act (ISA) detention in Kamunting.
Hamid cannot again pass the responsibility of the continued detention of the Hindraf 5 to the civil servants as he must bear full and final responsibility for the government’s refusal to heed the voices of the people in the March 8 “political tsunami” that the Malaysian Indians have legitimate grievances about their long-standing marginalization of their citizenship rights in the country, and the Hindraf 5 should be rewarded instead of being incarcerated for bringing the plight of the Malaysian Indians finally to the attention of the government and nation.
Yesterday, Suhakam Commissioner Datuk N. Siva Subramaniam denied allegations that Hindraf leader P. Uthayakumar had been denied proper medical care while in detention. What is most surprising is that Siva had only met representatives from various government quarters including Taiping Hospital, the police and the Kamunting detention centre but not Uthayakumar himself and it is most inadvisable on his part to venture such a bold judgment based solely on one-sided accounts.
Siva should have met Uthayakumar first before passing any judgment. Did he ask to meet Uthayakumar or was he denied access to the ISA detainee? If the latter, he should have told the authorities that he would not be able to offer any public judgment of the treatment of ISA detainees unless Suhakam is allowed free and unfettered access to them!
In Parliament, it had been customary in the past for Ministers, Deputy Ministers and Parliamentary Secretaries to blame civil servants for wrong or misleading answers – something completely unheard-of in first-world Parliaments and countries.
All the Ministers in the second Abdullah Cabinet must adopt a new mindset and culture of responsibility and should understand and accept that the buck of responsibility ends with them and that they cannot claim that they were only acting on the advice of the “Little Napoleons” in their ministries and departments.
Ministers and Deputy Ministers must master the subjects under their portfolio which they have to address in Parliament, whether during question time or debates, and they must bear full responsibility for every word uttered in Parliament. Civil servants cannot provide safety nets for Ministers and Deputy Ministers who made a fool of themselves in Parliament when giving wrong, misleading or even stupid answers.
In the new Parliament starting next week, Ministers and Deputy Ministers should accept that they have no safety nets when giving replies prepared by their civil servants as they do not have the luxury of blaming their civil servants for any mistake or misinformation for what they say in Parliament.
Ministers and Deputy Ministers are not “postmen” or “postwomen” of their civil servants when speaking in Parliament.
“Passing the buck” to blame civil servants for wrong or misleading answers given in Parliament should be a thing of the past as it is no more acceptable as higher standards are expected of the new Cabinet in the 12th Parliament.
How long will it take for the Hindraf 5 to be released.. those poor people did nothing but helped us..and to compare them to terrorists is too much!!!!!!!
What is this, a drama to show that the govt. can abuse its power and revoke again later? The govt. is so unfirm with the decision, any foreigner will dare to come?
Business versus Politics
Link: http://www.kingsmary.blogspot.com/
YB L.IM KS & YB KARPAL SINGH
Why you only mention about the realease of the Hindraf members that are being held under ISA but you don’t mention or highlight abou the so called JI members that has been in ISA for more then 6 years on charges that cannot be proven in court. It is because of their religion that you ignored them?
Yes, we should serious go for all ISA detainees to be released n demand that ISA be dismantled just like all other discriminative laws are erased from Malaysian lives.
Next important issue Kit and all PR members in Parliament should do is go after the Judiciary and review all political cases in the last 20 years and all judgements by compromised and inferior judges appointed to meet BN Government agendas. Too many people in jails today are victim of compromised judiciary. PM already admitted the wrong they did in Judiciary, so we suggest, in good faith, release at least 50% of all non serious criminal inmates with immediate effect.
Aliran – Home Ministry’s action suggests that important lessons from the electoral results – one of which is that the party didn’t feel carefully the nation’s pulse on the ground and refusing to respond and adapt adequately to the new political realities. It is still incapable of appreciating the importance of freedom of expression and of the media.
Read ALIRAN MONTHLY and get to understand the real issues crucial to our immediate future.
If BN component parties can mix business with politics, why not Business v. Politics? That’s their normal practice!
alfatih
LKS have always fight to release ALL ISA detainee regardless of race ,religion,etc.
He had always fight to have the govenment to give each and everyone a chance in court.
As a lawyer he knows ” everyone is innocent unless proven in court”.Albeit nowaday the court intergrity is questionable
Even a layman such as me knows that.
It is good to see how PEOPLE’s POWER can humble SOME VERY BIG EGOS………………..
Hamid Albar must be fuming and hopping mad at having to reverse himself because the boss could not make up his mind!
Hamid has learned an expensive lesson and may not play by ear this time round. This time he would do well to get a written memo signed by the boss himself especially when it involves releasing a whole bunch of people from detention! He would do well also to authenticate the signature on that memo!
“What is most surprising is that Siva had only met representatives from various government quarters including Taiping Hospital, the police and the Kamunting detention centre but not Uthayakumar himself …” Kit
How convenient to depend on second hand or third hand heresay! Because then you could clarify later without being seen to be losing too much integrity.
Do not worry . I have a feeling that the Hindraf 5 will be released before Parliament begins.
This WILL be done to avoid questions being asked by the opposition
and embarassmet it will course to the ruling government.
My best wishes to the Hindraf 5 and their brave families who have put up with such injustice at the hands of the BN
RELEASE THE 5 NOW ! NOW ! NOW ! BN AND NOT LATER
if the don’t why not ask Badawi to swap the place with Hindraf 5 and live in the conditions that they are for a week. This will be an eye opener.
For the sake of Humanity, yes Humanity, release them now! Leave politic aside please. This is human life we’re talking about. Please Mr. Syed Hamid. Don’t let power and politic destroy your human sense. Release them now.
abdullah badawi is still pulling the string.
YB LKS,
I heard that PK’s State can even issue the license to print newspaper right? Is that true?
May be when BN know that PK’s state issue the license, so instead of being the bad guy, they quickly change their mind to be the good one.
Shiok Guy
http://shiokguy.blogspot.com/
alfatih, please don’t create unnecessary tension on race and religion
Lim Guan Eng enter lokap helping a Malaysian regardless of race ,religion,etc…
So it’s d same here…
I’m a Malaysian and so is everybody here!
Saya Anak Malaysia!!! ^^
Oh yeah another thing, did you all realize that in The Star, there is no news what so ever about Bandar Mahkota Cheras!
Isn’t this a big national issue?
I pity all the new YB,s in states rule by BN. The BN goverment is not giving them any help, in kind or cash.In some places it is so bad,That the local council don,t want to have anything to do with PR YB,S.In one local council the YDP even told it staffs not to entertain any complains that comes from PR YB,s.This complains are actualy coming from us the tax payers.
If I were Hamid Albar, I would resign. Malu lah sekarang, being treated like an office boy. He’s useless anyway!
So, only release the Hindraf 5 is it? Aren’t you forgetting the rest of the ISA detainess, YB?
Uncle Lim,Raja Petra said there are another 90 ISA detainees other than Hindraf 5 who are still under detention.We need to free all of them,not just the 5.
I think ALL ISA detainees should be charged in court for whatever crime the police have collected evidence or release them.
This is an evil law when we give such power to the authorities.
For example: for the Hindraf 5, the police should be able to charge them in court for illegal assembly/obstructing traffic etc and for JI members maybe produce documents related to making bombs or plans to bomb public places.
http://malaysiawatch3.blogspot.com/2008/04/isa-and-recalcitrant-leaders.html
ISA is still necessary but must have proper restrictions and judicial review after perhaps 30 days maximum detention.
“ISA is still necessary but must have proper restrictions and judicial review after perhaps 30 days maximum detention.” HJ Angus
Agreed. You don’t want to act in haste especially now that there is a possibility PR may take over the federal government! Imagine using the ISA on BN politicians and give them a taste of their own medicine! That would be fun to watch!
But first you’d need to reinstate the legal and statutory safeguards which were there originally before Parliament amended the Act.
undergrad2
I’m sure you agree that most nations now have ISA-type laws post 911.
All laws can be abused and we should not really encourage the future government to abuse it. But it is a tempting idea!
To side track a little on a hot button issue affecting countries all over i.e. the skyrocketting prices you and I are being forced to pay for rice!
A bag of rice in the U.S. today has gone up by some 122% and rising!
An interesting take by poster TokyoBanker given in another blog –
“The hedge fund managers, especially, then ventured into the agriculatural commodity products like grains, rice, sugar etc, with the notion of just trying to make a few bucks.
If you put $100 million into the oil market, you could hardly move the oil prices by $1.00. However, if you put $50 million into the rice market, the rice price may double or triple within a month, which happened recently and causes the people’s riot in Haiti.”
So don’t you go hoarding and stockpiling rice!
What’s happening to the price of rice in Canada?
” complying obediently and blindly the dictates of the Little Napoleons in the bureaucracy ” but this has always been the way of doing things in the government service or else one will get nothing…
Global food crisis.
Stores across the U.S. are now limiting the amount of rice you can buy!!
Number of people now picking up their fruits and vegetables from the farms too have been increasing – cutting out the middlemen!
Chinese have a saying:
“One will not cry until one saw the coffin”
And how true this is to describe our current so called “government”!
I am so at peace with myself right now thinking that these tail wagging creatures are looking for ways to look more like a human!
Don’t joke, any creditability, if there is any, are gone. The time has come for a new government and a new revolution.
Opposition members and supporters should not just write to condemn the current heartless government, they should become in their free time ‘preachers’ and get more and more friends to fight and deny the current administration.
What is the point now to teach them to do right after so many wrongs have been done?! Reforms must be carried out not because they have lost 2/3 majority, but because it is their duty to do so!!
Apart from the reforms of the judiciary & etc., the public should also be well informed of all high profile cases that includes rape & kill cases (Canny Ong), Altantuya case, the drowning of the China nationals in a Datuk house, prosecute Lingam, take TDM to court & many many more! What is the status of all these cases???
I bet that after the judiciary reform had been carried out, even some very high cases involving wretched politicians will NOT be pursued! They will just announce some bu*****t and carry on like nothing has happened. Because its “cara mereka”!
WTF for reform?!
I suggest that the first order of business when PR takes over the government in August be to detain BN politicians turned rice traders be detained for hoarding rice and being a “threat to national security” – a term all too familiar with Malaysians.
**All the Ministers in the second Abdullah Cabinet must adopt a new mindset and culture of responsibility and should understand and accept that the buck of responsibility ends with them and that they cannot claim that they were only acting on the advice of the “Little Napoleons” in their ministries and departments.**
That is the reason why parliament sessions are aired over TV. A 3 year old kid has better reasoning OR excuses than them! Maybe a blessing in disguise also, because had they aired over TV, I worry what kind of poison would be absorbed by Malaysians.
YB LKS, they still need some time laa. How can we expect First World response from Third World people?? We the Rakyat has already moved on and they are still lagging behind and wagging like some dumb KAYU!
Malu lah!
are NOT aired ***typo error***
Rice futures this morning reached an all time high!
I am VERY SICK of BN’s policies now!
Pakatan Rakyat… quickly form the new
Federal Government. Really cannot wait
anymore!
YB
Since parliament will start next week, when will the shadow cabinet to be form?
To date still haven’t hear anything about it yet. In a way, we are now a two party democratic system. Every minister should be shadow closely now. It will show to the Rakyat that PR can administer with minimum interuption during a changeover.
PR is the government in waiting and not a one man show anymore !!
Btw, I wonder how much the ex minister has to lose for outraging the modesty of a woman.
Now want to hear what the AG going to say..
alfatih,
please do not create unnecessary conflicts here using religion and race issues.
YB Lim Guan Eng was jailed before for helping a female who is of a different religion.
I am sure YB did not blame their religion. He would have blamed the person or persons mistakes and narrow mindedness.
“Saya pantang di cabar”…………..sounds familiar??!
Sekarang sudah kena cabar, mau tukar ini tukar itu……..
tak ada malu kah ini macam punya ketua??!
Haiyohh!
Thank you for the fruitful comments. So when we are talking about injusties don’t just mention specific case only it must be on the whole picture not only on the HINDRAF issues. As long as there are injusties inflicted on other human beings then PR and BN MP’s must voice up irrespective of races or religion. So everybody must support the abolishment of ISA and other draconian acts executed by the BN Goverment.
If we have Suhakam Commissioner like Datuk N. Siva Subramaniam, who needs another commission? human rights commission, ACA commission, Police commission, election commission, Judiciary commission, what else, may be commission for racial equality, commission for religious tolerance, commission for civil service neutrality, commission for local authority, and fair pricing or anti competition commission. I think we are now suffering from commission syndrome.
Just to ask: How much of the escalation in prices of commodities, food and non food, is due to REAL shortage? How can the world suffer from food shortage overnight? How much do we know the current REAL production and consumption level? Are prices of commodities due to excessive speculative demand and manipulation of hedge fund activity? Why the World Bank and the IMF has not come up with any meaningful forecast/projection/figure with regard to REAL demand and supply of essential commodities? I hope someone could shed some light on this.
Stupid is forever, ignorance can be fixed.
Any government must stop the idea of banning newspapers.If the papers had reported anything against the rules of the country, the publisher or the editor should be hauled to the courts.The act of banning is cowardly.The people had shown how they could change a once popular government and soon the people will show through Democracy that all action will be accounted when the time comes.The Home Ministry had done the right move.It had listened to the voice of the silent and vocal majority.Now the ministry has one more proper move to make;that is to release the detained Hindraf leaders.The people will be sympathetic and will have a good view of the government.All will be watching.
If BN continues to treat states or constituencies won by PR, is BN telling the people of these states or constituencies that they are “outcast” and have been “disowned” by BN? And is BN ever going to stop collecting tax from these people? If BN continues to collect tax from them, then BN should do their part in serving these states and constituencies. Do not treat these people like “abandoned” children!!!!!!
It is good news for Makkal Osai to have their permit ” restored” , and the staff back to work, and none deprived of an employment.
I hope Makkal Osai would also remembered “that distasteful advert of Jesus Christ with a beer” !!. Press freedom, should not be used as a tool to insult or disgrace anyone’s race and belief.
ISA should be abolished , and all ISA detainees be released and if sufficient evidence is available let them be charged. I would not agreed to retain ISA for use against Bn in future, as it vengence seeking. Lessons can be learned from SIR Nelson Mandela, who spent 27 years in jail .
Mother nature has a way to teach arrogant homo sapiens, and this shortage of rice , wheat is a retribution of what we have done to our planet earth.
ISA is necessary but do not blame the abuse of it by the you-know-who. The reason YB LKS is asking for the release of only the HINDRAF 5 is most probably by the knowledge that he has on them. As a lawyer, how do you fight a case for your client unless you know their case? How else can you know someone more than the rest unless that you are a friend? I would fight the cause to release the HINDRAF 5 together with YB LKS because I knew these people and I knew their case and I knew it is a bona fide abuse of ISA by the you-know-who. I would personally vouch for the HINDRAF 5’s character!
However, concerning the rest of the ISA detainees that I do not know? I am sorry to say that I do not know these people personally. I have no idea about their case. How can I have an all-out fight for the release of them? Does one abuse of ISA equates to a total abuse? IT may, God knows… but I don’t and neither do YB LKS. It has nothing to do with religion, race or the sort of it, but just honest ignorance. Why is al-fatih so keen on bringing the religion issue up? While there is nothign wrong to call for the release of all those in ISA, it is totally inappropriate to suggest that YB LKS does not want to fight for these people because of their religion. Have you not heard of the power of suggestion? Please DON’T make suggestive notions unless you are sure that YB LKS is indeed acting as per your suggestion.Lighten up! Everything has its course in time. Keep the priority i.e. reform of the judiciary system! If one needs to be so extreme, then why only call for release of those in ISA and not those that have been wrongly prosecuted and sentenced to imprisonment during the biased judiciary system? Everything has its core. From the way I see it, unless the judiciary system has undergone the reform it so long overdue, we Malaysians will not see justice.
alfatih.
i support your stand, that dap and YB Lim and Yb karpal should also rally for the release of all ISA detainees. Ym raja petra have clearly written that many are locked in kamunting for as long as seven years. and even Tuan Guru Nik aziz’s son , spent five years under ISA.
does Yb lim,have a list of isa detainees ?
their race? their religion ? their reasons for being detained.
(malaysia today)
one chinese girl was detained because she preached christianity to malays.
one malay man was detained because he became a priest.
COME ON YB LIM. BE FAIR TO ALL. ISA MUST BE ABOLISHED.
kingkenny.
get a list of detainees at kamunting, before you accuse alfatih of creating confusion . there are more malays being detained than indians.
YB LIM.
can we get a list of ISA detainees published here ? or at least raise it in parliament please. DAP IS SUPPOSED TO BE MULTI RACIAL PARTY.
dear seage.
” i am sorry to say that i do not know these people personally”
Do you have to know them personally, to request our elected MPs to seek release of them?
I dont know the Hindraf 5 too, but i still will rally for their release.
As for the Chinese girl who talk about Jesus christ to the malays in Trengganu, is she a terrorist ? absolutely no. is she a threat to national security ? absolutely no. I think Karpal singh and DAp must consider this poor chinese girl too.
if any muslims, are so weak in their faith, that a chinese girl talking about Jesus, is perceived danger, than those muslims with weak faith must be sent for rehabiltation, not the chinese girl.
PL don’t even bother to answer mail from Mongolia how can he be good and outspoken leader?
the support of indians in this general election helps the swing of votes to pakatan raayat. this i acknowledge.
BUT, the malays also voted for dap .
AND WHO IS YM RAJA PETRA KAMARRDDIN ? a malay. he ambushed every umno leaders that are corrupted and mained many. when he was called to dang wangi, and later, marina abdullah was called to dang wangi, the couple did it because they LOVE MALYSIA and MALAYSIANS. – not indians,not chinese,not malays.
lakilompat.
what do you expect pl to reply.
moderator.
truth hurts.
lakilompat.
pl replies will be subjudice.
undergrad2 Says:
Yesterday at 21: 35.34
“ISA is still necessary but must have proper restrictions and judicial review after perhaps 30 days maximum detention.” HJ Angus
Agreed. You don’t want to act in haste especially now that there is a possibility PR may take over the federal government! Imagine using the ISA on BN politicians and give them a taste of their own medicine! That would be fun to watch!”
You believed that this draconian law is unjust and yet you want to use them for revenge. That is equally wrong! Abolish ISA and not use it as a weapon against anyone anymore. Let’s be rational.
Guys, it is all about the presumption of innocence. You are innocent until proven guilty. The burden is on your accuser to prove beyond reasonable doubt that you are guilty of the crime you are charged with.
But until you know the allegation or allegations made against you i.e. the offence of which you stand accused, how are you going to defend yourself?? What the ISA does inter alia is it reverses the burden of proof. You are guilty until proven innocent. The onus is instead on the accused and not his accuser.
All ISA detainees must be charged in court or released. Charge them or release them.
As for the lawyers they don’t decide if their clients are not guilty. The court does. The lawyers only defend their clients based on all the evidence. But how are the lawyers going to defend these people who are detained under the ISA? The detainees have no access to legal counsel. Jeffery QC can help me out on this one as I’m not sure if they have the right to counsel. More important they don’t even know what they are accused of?
What of indigent clients? Would they be given a lawyer if they cannot afford one?
For the time being the focus understandably is on the HINDRAF detainees who are the subject of international attention. But there is no reason why the rest of the detainees should not be charged or released if not charged! When they are charged in court and if the offences are bailable offences, bail should be set and they should be released on bail.
Bro Kit,
I am rather disappointed with the PR!
Yes, the HINDRAF 5 should be immediately released (or charged in Court). However, if I am not mistaken, there are a whole bunch of other ISA detainees also! What about them? Have we forgotten them? They should either be immediately released or charged in Court.
Please do not forget them all! God willing the PR will one day take over the Federal Govt. However, it has to show it deserves to rule!
“You believed that this draconian law is unjust and yet you want to use them for revenge. That is equally wrong! Abolish ISA and not use it as a weapon against anyone anymore. Let’s be rational.” ilovedap
It is unjust for the above reasons.
We must remember that today we are fighting terrorism, and against an enemy who look upon death as a release from their burden. who would rather die than live under terms not of their making. We must remember we are living in a post 9/11 world and countries all over have passed similar legislation.
We need legislation like the ISA but with the right to judicial review and other legal safeguards. It should be used only against terrorists. It was used among others against the father of the recently deceased Rustam Sani, Ahmad Boestaman who had links to the PKI (Indonesian Communist Party of Indonesia).
It is not to be used to suppress political opposition such as when it was used againt Kit and the others in Ops Lallang etc.
undergrad2
what are the two examples of the one chinese girl and a malay man got to do with terrorist and 9/11?
dear psm
there are about 90 poor souls in kamunting.
“As for the Chinese girl who talk about Jesus christ to the malays in Trengganu, is she a terrorist ? absolutely no. is she a threat to national security ? absolutely no.” ADAM
You may want to look up the Federal Constitution 1957 which forbids the proselytization of Malays and Muslims by non-Muslims. Was she proselytizing?
THERE ARE MANY DETAINED IN KAMUNTING UNDER ISA.
USING ISA AS A TOOL OF REVENGE IS JUST AS EVIL. dont even think about it.
State legislation imposes a fine or/and jail sentence for the offence of proselytization of Malays and Muslims.
Where is Jeffrey QC who is an expert on the matter? Perhaps he could cite the relevant section of the state legislation in the state of Trengganu.
“USING ISA AS A TOOL OF REVENGE IS JUST AS EVIL. dont even think about it.” ADAM
That was tongue in cheek!
DEAR UNDERGRAD.
my question was, what have they got to do with terrorist and 9/11.
yes or no ?
oophs.
TYPO ERROR.
undergrad 2.
hei , by now you should graduated and doing the master now.
i like your style, but you have to be fair please.
ADAM YONG,
getting the list of detainees now held in Kamunting is unnecessary. The question of why YB Kit is not helping other people of different faiths should not be raised in the first place. Are there any proofs to that? The whole ISA issue is so broad, it was used against ‘preachers’, so called terrorists, politicians, the public and many more, why suddenly religion took precedence above all?
We all know how the wretched BN politicians work here in Malaysia.
If YB Kit somehow succeed in releasing the Hindraf 5, don’t you think other detainees will have a better chance of release?
If the Hindraf 5 were released, it shows only thing:
ISA is flawed and MUST be reviewed and/or abolished.
And for the record, I sincerely hope whoever is detained in Kamunting will get their fair chance in court – they are not guilty unless proven in court with evidence.
So, please understand. I did not accused alfatih.
undergrad2
………imposing a fine or jail sentence….., than why ISA?
“ADAM YONG IBNI ABDULLAH Says:
Today at 10: 31.34 (2 minutes ago)
oophs.
TYPO ERROR.
undergrad 2.
hei , by now you should graduated and doing the master now.
i like your style, but you have to be fair please. – adam”
HAHaHAHA! That was funny, Adam!
Hey undergrad mate, I do love your eye for details and openness to discuss though.
The moment we have such a draconian law, who get to decide whether its use is against a terrorist, a sympathiser or political opponent? Who gets to define a person is a terrorist, a sympathiser, or a political opponent?
If this draconian law has all the safeguard like the right to judicial review and other legal safeguards, then is it still draconian?
Illogical and incoherent are forever. Only those who can see their own stupidity can be fixed.
Again, this is an act of terrorism. This bacth of BN people have never learnt the painful lesson from the just concluded election. l think the 5 Hindraf have or will not post any harmful national security to us at all. Do you think it is fair to keep these harmless people under ISA for the unforseen period of time?Again this is Malaysia style.Malaysia BOLEH.What ashame!!!!!!
Hello all,
Earlier on, i already warned that the Penang state and opposition state there will be alot of robberies. Soon, i’m predicting one of the bank will be robe within this year.
The 2nd robberies case in Bukit Mertajam Penang has already become obvious, right. These ppl. are used to have support from previous admin, but now, they have to resort to such.
DEAR KINGKENNY.
“getting the list of detainees now held at kamunting is unnecessary”
WRONG. WRONG, WRONG,
dear kingkenny, justice is for all.
if YB lim, publish the list, than we can know how to help them.
some have been there for seven years, and poor guy or gal, and because they are NOT SO FAMOUS, they are forgotten.
no one should be detained without trial.
or if you believe in fifo. ? (first in first out).
JUST ABOLISH ISA. RELEASE ALL ISA DETAINEES.
AND DONT SEEK REVENGE LATER. USING THE ISA.
Rice – this is madness! Everyone’s watching – rising of price is understandable due to expensive fertilisers and high oil prices for transporation, but Futures speculation is definitely playing a big part.
US and Canada are not large rice consuming nation yet rice movement and availability have made it to front pages of all newspapers. Walmart and CostCo are creating unnecessary frenzy; it’s predicated will end in tears one year from now!
Sir,
How about the renewal of “Oriental Daily Press”? It is that difficult to approve a license until need to wait for so many months?
sorry, last sentence, spell : “predicted”
ADAM,
I do agree with you that justice is for all irregardless of race and faiths. And ISA should be reviewed OR abolished OR replaced.
Justice is important to us, but so is SAFETY. There aren’t any guarantee there will not be any exploitation from the opposition side or the current ruling coalition side. Who knows people would be and could be instigated to cause riots and disharmony in our country?
FIFO, FILO, LILO also doesn’t matter, BN has already wrecked their lives for so long, what we can do is keep on fighting for them.
And if it is proven in court they are being held OR detained unlawfully by the government, then we can also fight for them to be paid compensation by the government – commensurate with the length of detention!
DEAR ILOVEDAP.
i have repeatedly stated that undergrad2 is one of the good and serious contributor to this blog. and i mean it.
thanks kingkenny for agreeing that justice is for all. thank you.
bye folks for now, will be in dubai for a week,( no time to blog ) and till than, MAY GOD BLESS YOU ALL.
and by the will of GOd, the 5 hindraf leaders will be released, followed by others. still abolish isa .
GOD BLESS YOU TOO MISS MODERATOR.
as we are guest in YB LIM’s blogsite. we should show respect to our host. if in any way, my comments have hurt yours or YB or anyone feeling, i deeply apologise.
thank you again.
Today at 09: 23.25 (1 hour ago)
dear seage.
” i am sorry to say that i do not know these people personally”
Do you have to know them personally, to request our elected MPs to seek release of them?
I dont know the Hindraf 5 too, but i still will rally for their release. [ADAM YONG IBNI ABDULLAH]
Dear Adam, you missed my point. I am trying to say that YB LKS is fighting for the HINDRAF 5 as it is blatantly an abuse of the ISA by you-know-who. While we should fight for all the ISA detainees, there is no need to bring religion into play. Don’t you think it is uncalled for especially to suggest that YB LKS is not doing this due to religion?
Plus, I don’t think everyone in the ISA detain centre is an abuse case (I may be wrong, God forbids), thus, saying that I do not know them and so couldn’t vouch for all of them. The real pressing matter is the reform of the judiciary system and the ISA. Only with these can we offer the ISA people a just trial and not having them detained forever till their body rot in Kamunting.
LAST BUT NOT LEAST SIR JEFFREY.
please continue your good job of writing from a 360 degree perspective. I HOPE YB LIM, realise that SIR JEFFREY is one good , intellectual yet so humble.
btw. i attended court myself and seek ajourment pending appointment of a lawyer. the defence lawyer so happy. haha.
last post.
namastes or warnegum ( forgive my spelling ) dear seage.
just help the rest of those in kamunting please. everyone of us are also human being. your blood is red, so is mine.
thank you.
GOD BE THE JUDGE. I FEAR GOD ONLY.
ADAM,
kasih mu di terima. Have a nice journey!
Pak Lah did mentioned that he fear no one but only god.
What sort or god does he fear actually?
Does Islam encourage muslim to lie and bully others?
Maybe if you do evil at all times, god will forgive you if you ask for forgiveness each time you do wrong.
What is it anyway?
Or maybe, he think he’s god himself!
I really do hope there’s one greater god who could punish these sort of people who use god’s name just to harm others for his personal gains.
Are poor Malaysians prepared for the coming big crunch?
Food is become increasingly scarce and expensive, and it is already unaffordable for many people. The world’s 200 wealthiest people have as much money as about 40 percent of the global population, and yet 850 million people have to go to bed hungry every night.
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,547198,00.html
http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,grossbild-1149977-547198,00.html
I hope we can look beyond the Hindraf5, the BIGGER picture is to abolish ISA
NotProudToBeMalaysian,
G-d is One & G-d is Just.
For me, the road to salvation is a good character, charity to the needy, observance and Faith.
Faith is significantly the stepping stone in character building or rehabilitation and leading the correct way of life and treating other lives (be it humans or animals). You may leave out fanaticism in all forms.
Not a single one soul will be LEFT OUT for judgment.
So, have Faith in G-d.
Jong,
You’re right about the price of rice. But it doesn’t seem to have anything to do with shortage.
A bag of rice in the U.S. today has gone up by some 122% and rising!
An interesting take by poster TokyoBanker given in another blog –
“The hedge fund managers, especially, then ventured into the agriculatural commodity products like grains, rice, sugar etc, with the notion of just trying to make a few bucks.
If you put $100 million into the oil market, you could hardly move the oil prices by $1.00. However, if you put $50 million into the rice market, the rice price may double or triple within a month, which happened recently and causes the people’s riot in Haiti.”
To Pakatan Rakyat and especially to Anwar!
Please execute your plan as soon as possible, if there’s any!
Do not wait any longer for time is running out.
ISA detainees need you to free them and the majorities of malaysians need you to kick Pak Lah’s gang out.
We don’t wish to be accuse by other countries of being a murderer
when we’ve no part in the killing of Altantuya.
And we want our economy to prosper as well as development to continue on boosting without any interference from the Barisan government.
We all knew very well that BN is totally selfish and they are not going to co-operate with the PR even if they say so.
They are just only a bunch of liars and losers.
We Malaysian could wait no more because day by day, more and more issues will crops out.
The BN is really making a hell out of us people even though they’re denying it.
For the sake of us all, go for it now!!!
I dont know why all of a sudden Hindraf 5, ISA and etc gotta do with God and Religion. Bottom line is release them! End of story. May God save Malaysia and bless us all.
“The moment we have such a draconian law, who get to decide whether its use is against a terrorist, a sympathiser or political opponent? Who gets to define a person is a terrorist, a sympathiser, or a political opponent?” limkamput
The court stupid!!
Who said “Stupid is forever, ignorance can be fixed” if not the great Confucius himself?
ilovedap,
In what ways are you going to release the Hindraf 5 and other detainees? Put a barrel on that guy head and order him to do so?
Or just by asking, please……!!!
If they’re willing to release them, they would have done that already. DAP can’t do that and not even PR either!
Pak Lah is very good in talking about religion and that’s why we’ve to use “god and religion” to talk back to him.
“Islam had diri???”
Have a good trip, ADAM! Looking forward to reading what you write here. Say hello to Lawrence of Arabia for me and please don’t think too much of Ms. Moderator. You’ve seen for yourself how she single handedly demolished an annoying character determined to destabilize this blog!
I would guess that those high-flying traders will speculate on just anything and now rice is the target.
Consumers too get sucked in a many people start to hoard and that just pushes up the price further.
I wonder how many percent of the economy is “created” by such speculation. These people do not really produce a real product and many operate on people’s fears.
One of the woes of the modern economy.
sorry typo
“sucked in as”
Draconian law has no judicial review, stupid!!! So how can the court decides? Who is stupid now?
If Draconian law has judicial review, then it is not draconian law, stupid!!
Adam, beware of unsolicited flattery. Wonder who is this annoying character who simply likes to hold sway in this blog?
“I wonder how many percent of the economy is “created” by such speculation. These people do not really produce a real product and many operate on people’s fears.One of the woes of the modern economy.” Hj Angus
Be careful Angus. I pointed this out earlier and was being labelled stupid. Talking about “know all” and provocation! I hope the Moderator is reading and following who is being provocative now and constantly calling others stupid.
“In Parliament, it had been customary in the past for Ministers, Deputy Ministers and Parliamentary Secretaries to blame civil servants for wrong or misleading answers – something completely unheard-of in first-world Parliaments and countries.” – YB Kit
Actually, the Ministers, Deputy Ministers etc. were telling the truth that they should not be responsible for the wrong or misleading answers, as the answers were prepared by civil servants who were incompetent in the first place and were there because of their skin colour & religion. The Ministers, Deputy Ministers etc. didnt like to take action against these incompetent civil servants because they were afraid of them, that they would lose their votes in election!!!
99% of these civil servants are very good in politiking, but very very poor in figures. Read my lips, 99% will give you a wrong answer if you asked them to provide statistics answer!!! Check it out!!!
NotProudToBeMalaysian Says:
Today at 12: 57.07 (1 hour ago)
ilovedap,
In what ways are you going to release the Hindraf 5 and other detainees?
By taking the keys, unlocking it and then tell them to sign a few documents and say “Hasta la vista, ISA”. :) Kidding.
That comment was merely for the Government. I hope that they can put politic aside and look at humanity point of view. On the other hand, I do hope that one day you will change your nick to “ProudtobeMalaysian”. Which means that the country is doing well.
There is definitely not a shortage of rice in US and Canada. We will see the fun if the govt cease the import from rice-producing countries like Thailand, Cambodhia and Vietnam, let them continue hoarding till the price comes down.
Due to their hot and humid climatical condition, they may find it quite impossible to keep for too long or they’ll soon get eaten up by beetles.
I believe Hamit Elba was under intense pressure to renew the publishing permit of Tamil daily Makkal Osai. Hamit Elba is not a person who would change his mind easily; it is hard to fathom what was the force behind him that caused him to change his mind.
Unfortunately there was no “effect and influential” third party to pressure him to release the Hindraf 5.
Today at 11: 25.41 (3 hours ago)
last post.
namastes or warnegum ( forgive my spelling ) dear seage.
just help the rest of those in kamunting please. everyone of us are also human being. your blood is red, so is mine.
thank you.
GOD BE THE JUDGE. I FEAR GOD ONLY. [ADAM YONG IBNI ABDULLAH ]
Dear Adam, yes, I agree that everyone of us are also human being and your blood is red, so is mine… and for that, so are those that is responsible for Bali Bombing, 911, London subway bombing and madrid bombing.
So what’s the point that you are trying to put through?
ilovedap,
To release those Hindraf 5 and other ISA detainees would be impossible as long as Pak Lah is around.
If he’s to do that, others will think that he’s giving in to the opposition.
Just look at the Mahkota Cheras issue, for example.
He’s not going to give in easily, especially to the DAP.
To another question, as long as Umno rules, I’ll always stick to my present name in this blog for good.
With the present ruling government, are you telling me that you’re real proud to be one?
Release all the 60 above ISA detainees. If you think that they have committed an offence; give them a fair trial; and with good lawyers and constitutionally appointed judges; not by Mr Korek Korek Korek
Thanks Dato’ Syed Hamid and your boss, the PM.
Good to let them free to write and publish again. This is a positive development for BN’s Home Affairs machinery.
I was getting worried when Dato Syed took the less positive stance.
To side track a little –
“There is definitely not a shortage of rice in US and Canada.” Jong
The shortage may not be actual but the price has almost doubled over the course of one year! We are also being told on TV that there’s no shortage!
We can all speculate as to the reason but it’s not going to make a difference as prices keep rising and real income shrinks. Rice in the U.S. is grown and mostly comes from California. The rest is imported from India, Vietnam and Thailand.
I suppose the U.S. government doesn’t put too much emphasis right now because Asians only make up some 3-4% and the Hispanic population some 24% of the total population.
Who say it is not going to make a difference if we know the cause of the price increase. If the prices of essential commodities are excessively manipulated by greedy speculators, i think we just have to shoot them all. If will make the difference to the prices.
Now didn’t the great Confucious once say “Stupid is forever, ignorance can be fixed”?
Too bad, my comment is under moderation. I think I know why – sensitive words! Will think of a way to get round it.
Rice – Exactly, it’s due to greedy “futures” speculators, that’s what it is. Call it “fixed”! Knew it was coming, they were already talking some 6 months back.
How do you plan to shoot them down limkamput, seek Najib’s help to blast them with …?
The only way is to play ‘tai-chi’ with them, keep off rice, eat more pasta and potatoes. US rice are just as good, if not better. So when there’s no demand for Asian rice, it will wreck those speculators. How long do you think they can last, huh?
Nope it doesn’t help. Too bad, have to wait.
Rice – Exactly, it’s due to greedy “futures” speculators, that’s what it is. Call it “fixed”! Knew it was coming, they were already talking some 6 months back.
How do you plan to shoot them down limkamput, seek Najis’s help to blast them with …C.?
The only way is to play ‘tai-chi’ with them, keep off rice, eat more pasta and potatoes. US rice are just as good, if not better. So when there’s no demand for Asian rice, it will wreck those speculators. How long do you think they can last, huh?
At last, got it through with minor adjustment!
Jong, that was what I suggested we should do (and I think anybody with some grey matter in his/her head will know I am saying in jest and perhaps in frustration) although one annoying “know all” character may label me stupid again. The problem with him is he knows not what he does not know and yet think others know less than him.
But then who can disagree with the great Confucious who says, “Stupid is forever, ignorance can be fixed”?
But how many will agree to change their diet and opt for bread, potatoes and pasta instead? At the rate the price of rice is climbing, it won’t be that cheap to eat rice anymore, so it’s good opportunity and timely for a world wide awareness campaign to discourage rice intake.
I think we have enough of rice here! Let’s move on.
Secretary Rice??
First it was sugar, then cooking oil and now it’s rice! All these are nothing but political games played by those in power to control the people of the nation. Since when people of Malaysia began consuming more sugar, more cooking oil or rice? If the demand has basically not increased and production has been consistent, why is there suddenly a shortage in supply????
To make more money!
The world is now totally at the mercy of rice exporting countries aided by “futures” speculators. The sudden supply disruption and low stockpiles sent almost all rice consuming countries scrambling to find supplies. This helped produced price swings.
Then emerged the oil producing Arab countries whose sudden ‘demand’ for rice at almost any price, increased the momentum! See the picture?
Time to change our diet, too much carb in rice, go for the lesser evil!
Don’t know about you but I think Secretary Rice has the answer.
The prices of rice and wheat are linked.
In the United States, wheat futures in Kansas City, Chicago and Minneapolis have surged to record highs on forecasts of tighter supplies and continued strong demand at home and abroad.
I am just puzzled. How many additional bowls of rice or load of bread can a person eat? I think instead of invading oil and food producing countries, what the US should do now is to round up and detain all the hedge fund managers, future traders and speculators in Guantanamo Bay indefinitely. Trust me, it will work. The world would be a better place without them, despite whatever they may say. They have never produced any damn thing – not even a grain of rice, and yet they are there to enjoy French wine and caviare everyday. They are worse than BN.
Yeah, round them all up and bring them to Malaysia and with the right connections it won’t be that difficult to get C… and blast them all to bits!
As for immigration records, not problem just get them erased, again with the right connection. :D
I am of the opinion that the HINDRAF 5 should be released BUT charged in court for sedition. Let them defend their outrageous statements and actions in an open court and let the law take its due course.
However, most people here are completely wrong on the reason why Pak Lah detained the 5 under ISA. The reason for this is that there were fears that this steet protest will invite counter protests from the Malays and turn bloody. In fact before their arrests some HINDRAF folks were planning to demonstrate in Kg Baru.
In fact, things were so heated up that the situation up North in Penang almost turned into another Kg Rawa/Kg Medan incident with open fights between Indians and Malays. Though the original cause was just a traffic accident, the whole matter turned racial with people being killed.
In fact both groups planned to attack each other and mobilising hundreds of people when the police moved in and arrested the key leaders to defuse the situation. There were some reports of this incident but it was downplayed and the severity of the situation was never reported.
I also disagree that Pak Lah’s motivation was political. If he was then he would have arrested many of those who took part in the BERSIH and other demos.
Also many people here thinks ISA detainees are all political. Under AAB, there are no political prisoners. Most of them are members of KMM and Al Mauna or drug lords / counterfeiters /etc.
Detainees alleged to be involved in terrorist activities should be charged and/or released to face trials in open courts. Detainees involved in drug, counterfeiting and other illegal activities and crimes unrelated to terrorism should be charged under the respective Sections of the Penal Code, and released on bail if the offences are bailable, to stand trial.
I suspect the government cannot release the HINDRAF detainees without coming under pressure to also release the others who have in fact been under detention for a much longer period – especially when the rest of the detainees were mostly Malays.
It will be seen as discriminatory. It will be seen as a weakness on the part of the federal government.
undergrad2
I agree with you, that being my personal view too.
I have spoken to a number of serving and retired police officers and they feel preventive laws such as ISA and Restricted Residence are still relevant and neccessary.
According to them, the problem is that the evidence the security services have are either insufficient or would result in these agencies’ “methods and sources” to be revealed. Another reason for the application of these laws due to the lack of witnesses who would come forward to give evidence. A ood example would be the Klang Indian gangsters held under RR. Despite many residents’ high profile complaints, apparently none of them were willing to come forward as a witness fearing reprisals.
Though I personally feel uncomfortable with such laws and the opportunity for abuse, many of these security people I spoke to assured me that everyone under held ISA and RR currently have solid reasons for their detentions.
As for HINDRAF 5,I was told that the reasons were more to do with the attitude of the detainees. This has been turned into a melodramatic Bollywood musical.
The continued claims of mistreatment by the HINDRAF 5, their attitude toward the wardens in Kamunting Hilton and the rowdy activities of their supporters seemed to have hardened the will of the Home Ministry.
There was a window of opportunity after the 12GE for their release and it would have happened especially after the MIC made an appeal. But then the detainees shot themselves in their foot by making outrageous claims about a lack of medical care and ill-treatment. This was not helped by their supporters’ antics.
The interesting this is that had MIC not been crushed in the 12GE, the chances of the detainees getting released after Samy Vellu’s appeal would have been much better. Now that MIC had been snubbed and the Indian representation reduced to a junior position in the cabinet, I don’t think the appeals by MIC or other Indian groups would matter.
The release is inevitable but the timing would be of AAB’s choosing
to maximize the political mileage.
Anyway Pakatan Rakyat folks should be cautious as the release of HINDRAF 5 would be more damaging to them than BN in a medium and long term.
We must not forget that we are living in a post 9/11 world. This single incident has changed the world and countries all over the world have passed similar legislation but with safeguards against their possible abuse.
In fact prior to 9/11 the U.S. has been critical of Malaysia and felt we should repeal our ISA. But instead as a result of 9/11 they have taken a leaf from our experience when fighting terrorism, and introduced their own ISA – the U.S. Patriots Act and the Real ID Act.
But they are important and major differences. They have very strong safeguards against abuse by the President and his powers are in any case temporary and they call for mandatory review by the U.S. Congress. Our ISA has been used to stem political dissent which is wrong! It is never the objective of Parliament when it passed the law for the Act to be used other than combating Communist terrorism. The father of recently deceased Rustam, Ahmad Boestaman had links to Indonesia’s PKI and he was detained by the Brits for eight years and by Tunku for four years. But Ops Lallang detainees are not new converts to Communism which was in its death throes!
Our courts in the 80s have chosen to give a liberal interpretation to the phrase “threat to national security”. Guess who was the Prime Minister than?? He and Musa Hitam made a toke release of ISA prisoners when they took over the reins and reneged on their promise to do away with it completely.
To repeal the Act in the post 9/11 is not unlike saying we have to ban automobiles because they can be used as a weapon!
undergrad2
An interesting footnote to the Operasi Lalang…some of the people who were detained at that time was due to none other than Anwar Ibrahim himself who used the opportunity to settle political scores…
Now the Political Transformer sings a different song…
Yes, the Pide Piper of Hamelin is now the Pide Piper of Cerok Tok Kun. I’m not sure who took the place of those rats.
Killer, I hope whatever you said was based on facts, which will make you a very knowledgeable insider. Otherwise, please have some respect for those whose freedom have been deprived.
Killer, I’ve been reading what you wrote and your exchanges with undergrad2, you sound to me as a BN insider, ..a cyber-trooper sent here? I don’t think it works anymore.
Umno/BN spent millions of ringgit in propaganda and advert in mainstream media yet they lost 5 states. If not for those postal and buying of votes, we would have buried BN and Umno.
Jong precisely, and assisted by gullible fools who are consumed by big fat ego! Let me see, never ending post 9/11, constitutionality and what else, oh quotations from sage that he knows nothing about!
Sometimes its good you need to ‘feign a pig to eat the tiger’, just lead him on and let him do the talking. Obviously we are all not “dungus”!
Well guys, whatever I had said here is in public domain if you cared to read your news and open your mind.
It is your prerogative whether to believe me or otherwise but the comments from people like myself is useful in providing checks and balances and stop this forum from turning into the Land of the Blinds / Land Where The Frogs Live Under A Coconut Shell.
Killer, please don’t be so condescending. We know enough to know the difference. We also don’t write long long story. Go read my comments on your “investment rules” in another thread.
Someone said, “In fact before their arrests some HINDRAF folks were planning to demonstrate in Kg Baru.”
Don’t see why Hindraf folks are so crazy to want to demonstrate in Kg Baru, NO OTHER PLACE IS IT?
Hindraf demo against Msia Govt policies, NOT AGAINST MALAY!
Jong
Could you please explain where / which seat UMNO won because of irregularities in postal votes ? And if that is true, why there is no PR candidate sue the EC ?
This is the same story like the one going around about Khairy’s victory at Rembau, without factual basis.
cheng on soo
HINDRAF is an organization led by people who are neither ethical nor truthful, despite their claim to have Gandhi as their spiritual guide.
I can assure you that I know the origins of HINDRAF and their leaders’ history since the late 90s. People like Uthaya are first and foremost are publicity seekers who would not hesitate to lie, cheat or break the law to achieve their aims. Their aim never been to help the Indians since their first entry into the world of NGOs.
I had the unfortunate luck of crossing the path with Uthaya even before the Kg Medan incident. And I had followed his cheap antics ever since that. While many of the NGOs were busy helping the Indian poor, people like Uthaya were busy trying to make some cheap publicities for themselves.
The story behind HINDRAF is not as simple as most people think. Many people will be shocked to hear the real history and origins of HINDRAF. Perhaps one day I might write to Malaysiakini about this.
Killer, please do it now, why one day you MIGHT write to Malaysiakini? Why MIGHT, you mean you are not sure of the fact or you are not sure you want to write.
Killer posted:
“It is your prerogative whether to believe me or otherwise but the comments from people like myself is useful in providing checks and balances and stop this forum from turning into the Land of the Blinds / Land Where The Frogs Live Under A Coconut Shell.”
Checks and balances? Land of the Blinds?
On what grounds do you postulate that you are speaking the truth?
What credibility do you have other than boasting about your so-called grasp of insider knowledge?
I would take your postulations with a truckload of salt due to three reasons:
i) Some of your postulations are falsehoods – witness your statement regarding the average Malaysian’s quality of life being on par with the average Singaporean. Also, you stated that Singapore has a strictly controlled banking environment when in fact it is one of the most liberal in Asia – contrast that with Malaysia.
ii) Your other postulations are merely allegations and opinions meaning any tom, dick and harry with internet access can post his two cents’ worth in cybespace. e.g. your assertion that HINDRAF are a bunch publicity cheapos
iii) The last one is the worst of the lot – namely you insinuate and slander certain persons such as your accusation of DAP leaders looking for lucrative state contracts from Lim Guan Eng in Penang. You can’t provide proof of that and your words could very well end you in the courthouse for character defamation if LKS chooses to do so.
lchk
Do I sense a certain frustration from your writings ? Chill out bro, this is after all a forum to debate ideas or share opinion. Don’t like it, just leave it. Either way, take it easy….
Allow me, for the sake of intellectual interest, answer your emotional outburts…oops, questions.
1. Singapore vs Malaysia quality of life : I stand by my statements. I will explain it in another post.
2. HINDRAF : I can assure you that I know what I am talking about. Didn’t I say that I know these opportunist bunch since the late 90s ? Watch out in Malaysiakini for my letter.
3. Well, what kind of proof that you are looking for ? Would a sworn statements from these leaders that they want lucrative contracts or plum, cushy jobs would be sufficient for you ? I can certainly raise the issue the next time I meet up with them. Or perhaps LKS can also assist me in this, using his good office and connections.
It is funny though about LKS suing for character defamation. If that is applied for what is written here, I very much doubt if there will be anyone left to post in this blog….
Land of the Blinds: Land of the Silenced.
Someone said, “Singapore vs Malaysia quality of life : I stand by my statements. I will explain it in another post.”
Would appreciate, if he also explain why we need RM2.28 to buy SG$1, when in 1984, it is only RM1.09, and in 1975, only RM0.99